New kerises: need opinions

ariel · 25th January 2013, 10:08 PM

The second one is a mystery to me... Sorry...
The entire furniture, - handle, scabbard, - is made from bone. Blade has crusts of rust ( pun not intended).
Here I need help in placing it.

ariel · 25th January 2013, 10:11 PM

Please help me with placing them correctly, defining them, dating them ( if possible) and expressing your opinion re. their worth.
If anyone is uncomfortable with openly telling me the truth, feel free to send me PM. Honesty is highly appreciated.

Thanks a lot.

Rick · 26th January 2013, 03:03 AM

I believe you're correct on the first one .
The second one is Sumatran, and the blade is kind of interesting, 3 waves .
Both these blades are better judged when viewed point upwards with the wide part of the gangya to the right .
Both are in need of the dress part below the handle; in the case of the E.Java/madura a mendak is needed; the Sumatran needs a selut (cup with stem) .

I don't mean to crack wise here, Ariel, but they are both worth whatever someone is willing to pay and you to accept .

Neither are 'treasures' monetarily .
They both have a certain rough charm; I'm sure that's why you acquired them .

ariel · 26th January 2013, 04:18 AM

Thanks Rick!
I was not asking for a monetary value.
Can anybody tell me where can I get decent mendak and selut for them?

David · 26th January 2013, 06:59 AM

I think the hilt on the first one is Javanese as well, not Madurese. You could have the sheath tested, but i'm willing to bet that there is no silver content there, just a white metal (mamas). I like this keris and dress. I often see mendaks sold on eBay if you're looking.
I will reserve comment on the second keris, but personally wouldn't spend too much time or money on a selut for it.

Sajen · 26th January 2013, 08:27 AM

Hello Ariel,

the first one is a Java keris like you write, blade is dapur tilam upih and the handle is putra satu type. I would place this keris to East Java or the North East coast from Java. Like David write I think that the sheath is from mamas. It is a decent keris IMHO. Is the fit inside the sheath good? A mendak for this one will be easy to obtain.

The second keris is much more interesting and I disagree here with David. It is a Minangkabau keris of typical form. I am nearly sure that the ensemble is in all parts old and original. Hilt and sheath are most probable from whale bone. Look here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8160
Please check the material, some hints are given in the thread. The blade you should clean with unsweated pinapple juice or lemon juice. It will be very more difficult to get a fitting pendokok for this keris. I will send you later at the day a pm.

Regards,

Detlef

asomotif · 26th January 2013, 09:58 PM

For the 2nd one I am with Detlef. Minangkabau.

Normally bone scabbards are a bit of a put off for me. I prefer wood.
But the blade looks good and old, indeed cleaning is necesarry.
The hilt is very charming with very nice details.

I would suggest to try get a very simple plain silver selut on this one, leaving all the attention for the lovely carved hilt.

Best regards,
Willem

25th January 2013, 10:08 PM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	#2 The second one is a mystery to me... Sorry... The entire furniture, - handle, scabbard, - is made from bone. Blade has crusts of rust ( pun not intended). Here I need help in placing it. Attached Images

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25th January 2013, 10:11 PM	#2
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Please help me with placing them correctly, defining them, dating them ( if possible) and expressing your opinion re. their worth. If anyone is uncomfortable with openly telling me the truth, feel free to send me PM. Honesty is highly appreciated. Thanks a lot.

26th January 2013, 03:03 AM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,414	I believe you're correct on the first one . The second one is Sumatran, and the blade is kind of interesting, 3 waves . Both these blades are better judged when viewed point upwards with the wide part of the gangya to the right . Both are in need of the dress part below the handle; in the case of the E.Java/madura a mendak is needed; the Sumatran needs a selut (cup with stem) . I don't mean to crack wise here, Ariel, but they are both worth whatever someone is willing to pay and you to accept . Neither are 'treasures' monetarily . They both have a certain rough charm; I'm sure that's why you acquired them .

26th January 2013, 04:18 AM	#4
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Thanks Rick! I was not asking for a monetary value. Can anybody tell me where can I get decent mendak and selut for them?

26th January 2013, 06:59 AM	#5
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,284	I think the hilt on the first one is Javanese as well, not Madurese. You could have the sheath tested, but i'm willing to bet that there is no silver content there, just a white metal (mamas). I like this keris and dress. I often see mendaks sold on eBay if you're looking. I will reserve comment on the second keris, but personally wouldn't spend too much time or money on a selut for it.

26th January 2013, 08:27 AM	#6
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,675	Hello Ariel, the first one is a Java keris like you write, blade is dapur tilam upih and the handle is putra satu type. I would place this keris to East Java or the North East coast from Java. Like David write I think that the sheath is from mamas. It is a decent keris IMHO. Is the fit inside the sheath good? A mendak for this one will be easy to obtain. The second keris is much more interesting and I disagree here with David. It is a Minangkabau keris of typical form. I am nearly sure that the ensemble is in all parts old and original. Hilt and sheath are most probable from whale bone. Look here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8160 Please check the material, some hints are given in the thread. The blade you should clean with unsweated pinapple juice or lemon juice. It will be very more difficult to get a fitting pendokok for this keris. I will send you later at the day a pm. Regards, Detlef

26th January 2013, 09:58 PM	#7
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,238	For the 2nd one I am with Detlef. Minangkabau. Normally bone scabbards are a bit of a put off for me. I prefer wood. But the blade looks good and old, indeed cleaning is necesarry. The hilt is very charming with very nice details. I would suggest to try get a very simple plain silver selut on this one, leaving all the attention for the lovely carved hilt. Best regards, Willem