LEST WE FORGET

kahnjar1 · 24th April 2016, 09:10 PM

Today is April 25th marked as ANZAC DAY, and on this day 101 years ago, Australian, New Zealand, and other Allied troops landed at Gallipoli.
The folly of this action is etched history.
LEST WE FORGET

Jim McDougall · 26th April 2016, 12:41 AM

Sad memories but tempered with monumental pride for those brave men.
They will never be forgotten. The orders they followed and obeyed were the worst folly imaginable, but as true soldiers they carried them out.
Well posted Stu.

Jim McDougall · 26th April 2016, 07:26 AM

Focus on remembering this day with respect for the fallen.

Stu, your PM box is full.

kahnjar1 · 26th April 2016, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Focus on remembering this day with respect for the fallen.

Stu, your PM box is full.

Thank you Jim. That was the purpose of posting this in the first place.

BANDOOK · 26th April 2016, 01:53 PM

Anzac and India: A shared but forgotten camaraderie

Posted on 10 March 2014

Anzac and India: A shared but forgotten camaraderie

“Before the war who had ever heard of ANZAC? Hereafter who will ever forget it?” …by saying this British Commander at Gallipoli, General Sir Ian Hamilton best summed up the spirit of Anzac.

Gallipoli was the strife of people of different races and it has had a special impact on Australia, New Zealand and Turkey, who have kept the spirit alive. What is not immediately remembered is that there was a significant participation by troops from India. A million Indian troops fought in the First World War, of them 700,000 were pitted against the Ottoman Empire. In Gallipoli they formed part of the Australia New Zealand Division. Of 5010 Indians who served in Anzac, 1926 died and 3863 were wounded, some more than once. The number of dead, although horrific, paled in comparison with the number that died in France and Belgium.

“This fighting force was complete only with the participation of troops from India. Several accounts of the campaign remember the Indian soldiers and the camaraderie they shared, which alas is not commemorated as much as it rightly deserves.” The Australian Imperial Force commemorating the Australia New Zealand Division.

Constraints

There were many constraints to the participation, not only to the British Empire but also to the troops. It was a time when the 1857 mutiny and the Afghan campaigns were still in the memories of the British and it influenced policy within the Indian Army. Around this time the Ottoman Empire had launched its pan-Islamic movements that held the Caliphate in Turkey in high esteem and Muslims in India were sympathetic to protecting it. This was also the time when an Indian Muslim League had formed with separate demands. The freedom movements in India were beginning to gain momentum. In 1903-4, Lord Kitchener, the C in C of the Indian Army, started re organizing the army into field formations under commands and divisions, preferring troops from new found regions and loyalties.

Contributions

The Indian contribution to the First World War was in the form of seven Expeditionary Forces (A to G), fighting in the Western front, East Africa Campaign, British East Africa, Mesopotamia, Sinai and Palestine, First Suez Offensive and the Gallipoli Campaign. The Mesopotamia Campaign was almost entirely an Indian one.

It was Expeditionary Force G that fought in the Gallipoli Campaign. It comprised the 29th Indian Brigade, which had under its command four Infantry Battalions, namely: 14th (King Georges Own) Ferozepur Sikhs, 1/5th Gurkha Rifles (Frontier Force), and the 1/6th and 2/10th Gurkha Rifles. An artillery component: 7th Mountain Artillery Brigade with 21st (Kohat) and the 26th (Jacob’s) Mountain Batteries, equipped with breech loading 10-pounder guns. These mountain batteries were the first to be reluctantly Indian ised after the great mutiny of 1857. Further, except for the Gurkha battalions, all other units had equal components of Muslim troops. As the Ottoman Empire at that time held sway over the Islamic world and Indian troops were subject to Turkish propaganda, units with Muslim troops were quickly moved away to France, leaving mainly the Gurkhas to fight it out in Gallipoli.

There was also an Indian mule cart train of the Indian Supply and Transport Corps whose services were vital for the operations of the entire Anzac. The lone Indian muleteer who stayed back to provide logistic support to Kiwis is part of part of folk lore to date. All these units were further served by the 108th Indian Field Ambulance. In addition, 69 Punjabis and 89 Punjabis, on their way to France and Flanders as part of 7th Indian Infantry Division were rerouted and sent to Gallipoli.

The Battles

Anzac map

The Battle of Gallipoli had raged on two fronts, Anzac Cove and Cape Helles (see map on left), for three months since the invasion of 25
- See more at: http://www.freeperception.com/anzac-....pVOp23jU.dpuf
Regards
RAJESH

Norman McCormick · 26th April 2016, 07:11 PM

Scotland Remembers

Jim McDougall · 28th April 2016, 12:47 AM

Aye Norman!
Well placed, and proudly so.

kahnjar1 · 24th April 2023, 07:02 AM

...and they are still remembered.
April 25th each year New Zealand and Australia commemorate ANZAC Day when our troops landed on Gallipoli.
History records the folly of this action. WE WILL REMEMBER THEM

Rick · 24th April 2023, 01:54 PM

Waltzing Matilda No More give it a listen mates.
God bless 'em all.

Norman McCormick · 25th April 2023, 01:15 PM

Hi,
Along with the gallant ANZAC's landed at Gallipoli were troops of the 52nd Lowland Division comprising mainly of men recruited from the Glasgow area. Among them were men of the Highland Light Infantry. My great-uncle was in the H.L.I. prior to WW1 demobbed in 1912 and recalled to duty in 1916. The attached photos are of the 7th Battalion leaving, possibly for the Gallipoli campaign. The 18th Battalion returning home in 1918 and a drum in my collection belonging to the 17th Service Battalion (Glasgow Chamber of Commerce) who's men saw action in France from 1915.
WE WILL REMEMBER THEM

Regards,
Norman.

Ian · 26th April 2023, 06:00 PM

Thanks Stu and Norman. I had the pleasure this year of attending the dawn service here in Melbourne at the Shrine of Remembrance on ANZAC Day. It was the best attendance since 2019. Always a very moving service to honor those who gave up their tomorrows so we could have today. The last Aussie digger from WWI died a few years ago and we are running low on WWII veterans who still attend. A fair number in wheelchairs at the service but none who march in the parade.

Age shall not weary them nor the years condemn ...

gp · 29th April 2023, 10:27 PM

...

kahnjar1 · 24th April 2024, 09:58 PM

Another year has passed and once again we remember those who gave their lives in the folly of war.
Today is April 25th which is ANZAC DAY remembering those who fell at Gallipoli in WW1.

gp · 2nd June 2024, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Waltzing Matilda No More give it a listen mates.
God bless 'em all.

a very beautiful version of the song by the Pogues ( RIP Shane) to show their respect.

Remarkable and yet respectful as there is a dualistic issue:

quite some Irish joined the British army in WWI as volunteers, but also quite some were "shipped" to down under (The Fields of Athenry) and even some British became a little later the Dúchrónaigh, AKA Black and Tans.

Nevertheless as said, a nice version with some nice pics

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TThjY_qlEfg

24th April 2016, 09:10 PM	#1
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	LEST WE FORGET Today is April 25th marked as ANZAC DAY, and on this day 101 years ago, Australian, New Zealand, and other Allied troops landed at Gallipoli. The folly of this action is etched history. LEST WE FORGET Attached Images

26th April 2016, 07:26 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,946	Focus on remembering this day with respect for the fallen. Stu, your PM box is full. Last edited by Jim McDougall; 26th April 2016 at 07:39 AM.

26th April 2016, 01:53 PM	#5
BANDOOK Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: AUCKLAND,NEW ZEALAND Posts: 624	Indias contribution in Gallipoli-Anzac and India Anzac and India: A shared but forgotten camaraderie Posted on 10 March 2014 Anzac and India: A shared but forgotten camaraderie “Before the war who had ever heard of ANZAC? Hereafter who will ever forget it?” …by saying this British Commander at Gallipoli, General Sir Ian Hamilton best summed up the spirit of Anzac. Gallipoli was the strife of people of different races and it has had a special impact on Australia, New Zealand and Turkey, who have kept the spirit alive. What is not immediately remembered is that there was a significant participation by troops from India. A million Indian troops fought in the First World War, of them 700,000 were pitted against the Ottoman Empire. In Gallipoli they formed part of the Australia New Zealand Division. Of 5010 Indians who served in Anzac, 1926 died and 3863 were wounded, some more than once. The number of dead, although horrific, paled in comparison with the number that died in France and Belgium. “This fighting force was complete only with the participation of troops from India. Several accounts of the campaign remember the Indian soldiers and the camaraderie they shared, which alas is not commemorated as much as it rightly deserves.” The Australian Imperial Force commemorating the Australia New Zealand Division. Constraints There were many constraints to the participation, not only to the British Empire but also to the troops. It was a time when the 1857 mutiny and the Afghan campaigns were still in the memories of the British and it influenced policy within the Indian Army. Around this time the Ottoman Empire had launched its pan-Islamic movements that held the Caliphate in Turkey in high esteem and Muslims in India were sympathetic to protecting it. This was also the time when an Indian Muslim League had formed with separate demands. The freedom movements in India were beginning to gain momentum. In 1903-4, Lord Kitchener, the C in C of the Indian Army, started re organizing the army into field formations under commands and divisions, preferring troops from new found regions and loyalties. Contributions The Indian contribution to the First World War was in the form of seven Expeditionary Forces (A to G), fighting in the Western front, East Africa Campaign, British East Africa, Mesopotamia, Sinai and Palestine, First Suez Offensive and the Gallipoli Campaign. The Mesopotamia Campaign was almost entirely an Indian one. It was Expeditionary Force G that fought in the Gallipoli Campaign. It comprised the 29th Indian Brigade, which had under its command four Infantry Battalions, namely: 14th (King Georges Own) Ferozepur Sikhs, 1/5th Gurkha Rifles (Frontier Force), and the 1/6th and 2/10th Gurkha Rifles. An artillery component: 7th Mountain Artillery Brigade with 21st (Kohat) and the 26th (Jacob’s) Mountain Batteries, equipped with breech loading 10-pounder guns. These mountain batteries were the first to be reluctantly Indian ised after the great mutiny of 1857. Further, except for the Gurkha battalions, all other units had equal components of Muslim troops. As the Ottoman Empire at that time held sway over the Islamic world and Indian troops were subject to Turkish propaganda, units with Muslim troops were quickly moved away to France, leaving mainly the Gurkhas to fight it out in Gallipoli. There was also an Indian mule cart train of the Indian Supply and Transport Corps whose services were vital for the operations of the entire Anzac. The lone Indian muleteer who stayed back to provide logistic support to Kiwis is part of part of folk lore to date. All these units were further served by the 108th Indian Field Ambulance. In addition, 69 Punjabis and 89 Punjabis, on their way to France and Flanders as part of 7th Indian Infantry Division were rerouted and sent to Gallipoli. The Battles Anzac map The Battle of Gallipoli had raged on two fronts, Anzac Cove and Cape Helles (see map on left), for three months since the invasion of 25 - See more at: http://www.freeperception.com/anzac-....pVOp23jU.dpuf Regards RAJESH

26th April 2016, 07:11 PM	#6
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Scotland Remembers Attached Images

24th April 2023, 07:02 AM	#8
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	Now 108 Years on...... ...and they are still remembered. April 25th each year New Zealand and Australia commemorate ANZAC Day when our troops landed on Gallipoli. History records the folly of this action. WE WILL REMEMBER THEM Attached Images

26th April 2016, 12:41 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,946	Sad memories but tempered with monumental pride for those brave men. They will never be forgotten. The orders they followed and obeyed were the worst folly imaginable, but as true soldiers they carried them out. Well posted Stu.

28th April 2016, 12:47 AM	#7
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,946	Aye Norman! Well placed, and proudly so.

24th April 2023, 01:54 PM	#9
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	ANZAC Day Waltzing Matilda No More give it a listen mates. God bless 'em all.

25th April 2023, 01:15 PM	#10
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Hi, Along with the gallant ANZAC's landed at Gallipoli were troops of the 52nd Lowland Division comprising mainly of men recruited from the Glasgow area. Among them were men of the Highland Light Infantry. My great-uncle was in the H.L.I. prior to WW1 demobbed in 1912 and recalled to duty in 1916. The attached photos are of the 7th Battalion leaving, possibly for the Gallipoli campaign. The 18th Battalion returning home in 1918 and a drum in my collection belonging to the 17th Service Battalion (Glasgow Chamber of Commerce) who's men saw action in France from 1915. WE WILL REMEMBER THEM Regards, Norman. Attached Images Last edited by Norman McCormick; 25th April 2023 at 02:04 PM.

26th April 2023, 06:00 PM	#11
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,200	Thanks Stu and Norman. I had the pleasure this year of attending the dawn service here in Melbourne at the Shrine of Remembrance on ANZAC Day. It was the best attendance since 2019. Always a very moving service to honor those who gave up their tomorrows so we could have today. The last Aussie digger from WWI died a few years ago and we are running low on WWII veterans who still attend. A fair number in wheelchairs at the service but none who march in the parade. Age shall not weary them nor the years condemn ...

29th April 2023, 10:27 PM	#12
gp Member Join Date: May 2020 Posts: 719	... Last edited by gp; 29th April 2023 at 11:36 PM.

24th April 2024, 09:58 PM	#13
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	WE WILL REMEMBER THEM Another year has passed and once again we remember those who gave their lives in the folly of war. Today is April 25th which is ANZAC DAY remembering those who fell at Gallipoli in WW1. Attached Images