AFGHAN GUN ACCESSORY BELT

rickystl · 24th January 2016, 06:35 PM

Hello all. Here is a new aquisition. I experienced a weak moment and just had to have this. LOL

For now, I'm calling it Afghan since it exibits the typical style and accessories found on these belts. This is quite a neat belt with many accessories, a a couple surprises. I've taken all of the items off the belt to more easily describe and photograph each item. I'll re-attach all the items to the belt in what I think would be a likely manner, and take a couple additional photos with the belt and accessories together. Meantime, hope you enjoy. Here are a bunch of photos. Comments are most welcome. And thanks for looking.
Rick.
Here is a list of the items:

1. Waist Belt. With unusual double tounge and engraved brass buckle.
2. What appears to be semi-armoured crouch protection (?) Decorated brass attached to heavy leather. Really curious about this item.

3.Main charge powder horn, with tilt-up leather spout, which looks like it originally had a slightly longer thumb piece. Made of horn, and still usable. A few granules of black powder were still in the horn.
4. Smaller priming flask with worn, carved decoration, with it's original leather stopper, and VERY COOL decorative leather suspension hanger. Brass buttons say: "Bombay Artillery". Might be war souveniers (?). A few granules of black powder were in this one also. Flask is still usable.
5. Powder measurer with ratten reinforcement and traces of red and green paint. Still usable.
6. Single brass belt hook. There have been discussions in the past as to the purpose of these hooks. Don't recall if it was ever resolved. Possible for just hanging general purpose items (?) Very decorative heavy brass.
7. Hand Steel. For flint and steel firemaking. Has a brass and long leather belt suspension. And even has it's own holster. VERY NEAT !!! Could still be used.
8.Single pocket pouch with decorative brass cover on the flap and ends. Pouch is usable. Inside the pouch was a bunched up piece of old unbleached linen. NEAT !!
9. Slightly smaller pouch with a double pocket inside with similar brass decoration on the flap and ends. Inside the pouch was another small amount of the same linen - and - a small piece of knapped flint, which was likely used with the steel for firemaking. I did not expect, nor was it advertised that there was anything inside the pouches. NICE SURPRISE FOR ME !!

The brass pieces need a bit of careful cleaning. And the leather needs a bit of preservative. I'll do this and re-assemble the belt and take some additional photos. Again, thanks for looking. Rick.

rickystl · 24th January 2016, 06:36 PM

MORE PHOTOS

rickystl · 24th January 2016, 06:42 PM

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rickystl · 24th January 2016, 06:44 PM

STILL MORE

rickystl · 24th January 2016, 06:45 PM

LAST ONES

kahnjar1 · 24th January 2016, 07:36 PM

Hi Rick,
You have to be pleased with this don't you? Took a bit of prodding from a few mates but you got there in the end.

The only comment I can pass apart from the fact that what you have is full of interesting bits, is that the buckle appears to be typical of those from Oman....see pic below.
I have also attached a pic of the full rig from the sellers listing.
Stu

AJ1356 · 25th January 2016, 05:51 PM

Very nice and complete acquisition. I don't believe it is Afghan though, to me it has a lot of Indian aspects to it and I am having a hard time finding any Afghan aspects. The brass work, the birds in the buckle, the circles marks and many others, not to mention the British artillery of Bombay (Mumbai) badges, all scream Indian, maybe even South Indian.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 25th January 2016, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kahnjar1

Hi Rick,
You have to be pleased with this don't you? Took a bit of prodding from a few mates but you got there in the end.

The only comment I can pass apart from the fact that what you have is full of interesting bits, is that the buckle appears to be typical of those from Oman....see pic below.
I have also attached a pic of the full rig from the sellers listing.
Stu

Salaams kahnjar1....Nice Omani boys belt...These were sometimes made with castings done using cuttlefish bones as the mold.

With Afghan belts it is always interesting as spoils of war often adorn the Afghan belt. Old buttons and parts of Bugles etc...

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Kubur · 25th January 2016, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickystl

Hello all. Here is a new aquisition. I experienced a weak
9. Slightly smaller pouch with a double pocket inside with similar brass decoration on the flap and ends. Inside the pouch was another small amount of the same linen - and - a small piece of knapped flint, which was likely used with the steel for firemaking. I did not expect, nor was it advertised that there was anything inside the pouches. NICE SURPRISE FOR ME !!
Rick.

Hi Rick,

I'm really jaleous, what a very beautiful belt!!
And what a nice surprise, the treasure box...
Beautiful Afghan belt buckle with the typical twin doves...

Best,
Kubur

Pukka Bundook · 25th January 2016, 09:11 PM

Very interesting to see a complete outfit like this, Rick!

If it Is from Afghanistan, the Bombay 1st and 2nd Mountain Batteries of artillery served there between 1878 and 1881.

To me, it adds up. :-)

More later.

Richard.

rickystl · 1st February 2016, 02:07 AM

Hello all. Thank you all for your kind comments. Yes, Stu's right. It took a bit of proding from a couple members and a bit of hand holding. Of course, I wanted it. And they said I needed it!!! Some friends. LOL!!

It really is a neat belt assembly. So many neat accessories to study. I'll do a bit of careful cleaning this week.
Stu: Thanks for adding the pic of the assembled belt from the seller. I should have done this first.
Richard: That was also my thinking. It does make sense.

I want to display this belt without using a man sized manikin. So I got the idea of using a coat/hat stand and wraping the center post with bubble wrap to equal about 36" in diameter, and then covering the bubble wrap with red or blue material. Sounds a bit hoaky, but it would also allow me to display this belt, my other Afghan belt and cartridge bandolier, as well as hang my various horns and flasks. But maybe you guys have a better idea?

Rick.

kahnjar1 · 1st February 2016, 02:41 AM

Yep Sounds good. Rather than bubble wrap what about a large diam cardboard or plastic tube and cover that with fabric. Seems to me you would need a large amount of bubble wrap to get to 36"!!
]

rickystl · 1st February 2016, 02:57 AM

Hi Stu.
I somewhat mis-spoke. I should have said that equal to about a 36" belt size to equal an average man's waist size. LOL

So it would not be that much bubble wrap. Yes, the cardboard tube or plastic pipe (pvc pipe) could work. But I thought the bubble wrap idea was good since it would be very light weight and offer some "flex" to snug the belts up and help to keep the belts from sliding downwards.
And as long as I'm at it, I could add this Choora/Pesh Kabz to the belt accessories? What do you think ?

Rick.

kahnjar1 · 1st February 2016, 03:25 AM

Hi Rick,
Nice looking Pesh/Choora. I suspect by the look of it that the scabbard is much newer than the knife. Scabbards are usually decorated but this looks plain. Also is that machine stitching along the bottom?
The Pesh/Choora knife would certainly be in keeping with the belt and you will now also need to add a Khyber Knife (Salawar) to the rig. Looks as if you are going to start collecting blades by default!

rickystl · 1st February 2016, 12:22 PM

Hi Stu.
Yes, it looks like machine stiching to me. It appears to be an older scabbard with a much latter leather cover. The blade itself is still strong and sharp.
Rick.

David R · 1st February 2016, 01:03 PM

What struck me was how closely the buckle and other bits resembled the fittings on a Roman military belt of the first Century AD.

Kubur · 1st February 2016, 01:23 PM

David,

I think that you are more than right.
I had the same thought with the Caucasian belt, so Roman for me.
And I don't talk about the Kindjal and the Roman gladius...
I guess Romans stroke the Caucasian / Central Asian traditions (including Rick's belt, that I suspect to be from Northern Afghanistan).

Kubur

Kubur · 1st February 2016, 01:29 PM

more clear

rickystl · 6th February 2016, 06:55 PM

Thank you all for your interest and comments. Much appreciated.
I'll let you know how the coat rack stand idea works out.

LOL. It will at least allow me to display a bunch of items in one corner.

Rick.

24th January 2016, 06:35 PM	#1
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	AFGHAN GUN ACCESSORY BELT Hello all. Here is a new aquisition. I experienced a weak moment and just had to have this. LOL For now, I'm calling it Afghan since it exibits the typical style and accessories found on these belts. This is quite a neat belt with many accessories, a a couple surprises. I've taken all of the items off the belt to more easily describe and photograph each item. I'll re-attach all the items to the belt in what I think would be a likely manner, and take a couple additional photos with the belt and accessories together. Meantime, hope you enjoy. Here are a bunch of photos. Comments are most welcome. And thanks for looking. Rick. Here is a list of the items: 1. Waist Belt. With unusual double tounge and engraved brass buckle. 2. What appears to be semi-armoured crouch protection (?) Decorated brass attached to heavy leather. Really curious about this item. 3.Main charge powder horn, with tilt-up leather spout, which looks like it originally had a slightly longer thumb piece. Made of horn, and still usable. A few granules of black powder were still in the horn. 4. Smaller priming flask with worn, carved decoration, with it's original leather stopper, and VERY COOL decorative leather suspension hanger. Brass buttons say: "Bombay Artillery". Might be war souveniers (?). A few granules of black powder were in this one also. Flask is still usable. 5. Powder measurer with ratten reinforcement and traces of red and green paint. Still usable. 6. Single brass belt hook. There have been discussions in the past as to the purpose of these hooks. Don't recall if it was ever resolved. Possible for just hanging general purpose items (?) Very decorative heavy brass. 7. Hand Steel. For flint and steel firemaking. Has a brass and long leather belt suspension. And even has it's own holster. VERY NEAT !!! Could still be used. 8.Single pocket pouch with decorative brass cover on the flap and ends. Pouch is usable. Inside the pouch was a bunched up piece of old unbleached linen. NEAT !! 9. Slightly smaller pouch with a double pocket inside with similar brass decoration on the flap and ends. Inside the pouch was another small amount of the same linen - and - a small piece of knapped flint, which was likely used with the steel for firemaking. I did not expect, nor was it advertised that there was anything inside the pouches. NICE SURPRISE FOR ME !! The brass pieces need a bit of careful cleaning. And the leather needs a bit of preservative. I'll do this and re-assemble the belt and take some additional photos. Again, thanks for looking. Rick. Attached Images

24th January 2016, 06:36 PM	#2
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	MORE PHOTOS Attached Images

24th January 2016, 06:42 PM	#3
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	OK MORE PHOTOS Attached Images

24th January 2016, 06:44 PM	#4
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	STILL MORE Attached Images

24th January 2016, 06:45 PM	#5
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	LAST ONES Attached Images

24th January 2016, 07:36 PM	#6
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	Hi Rick, You have to be pleased with this don't you? Took a bit of prodding from a few mates but you got there in the end. The only comment I can pass apart from the fact that what you have is full of interesting bits, is that the buckle appears to be typical of those from Oman....see pic below. I have also attached a pic of the full rig from the sellers listing. Stu Attached Images

25th January 2016, 05:51 PM	#7
AJ1356 Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Nashville Posts: 314	Very nice and complete acquisition. I don't believe it is Afghan though, to me it has a lot of Indian aspects to it and I am having a hard time finding any Afghan aspects. The brass work, the birds in the buckle, the circles marks and many others, not to mention the British artillery of Bombay (Mumbai) badges, all scream Indian, maybe even South Indian.

25th January 2016, 09:11 PM	#10
Pukka Bundook Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 803	Very interesting to see a complete outfit like this, Rick! If it Is from Afghanistan, the Bombay 1st and 2nd Mountain Batteries of artillery served there between 1878 and 1881. To me, it adds up. :-) More later. Richard.

1st February 2016, 02:07 AM	#11
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	Hello all. Thank you all for your kind comments. Yes, Stu's right. It took a bit of proding from a couple members and a bit of hand holding. Of course, I wanted it. And they said I needed it!!! Some friends. LOL!! It really is a neat belt assembly. So many neat accessories to study. I'll do a bit of careful cleaning this week. Stu: Thanks for adding the pic of the assembled belt from the seller. I should have done this first. Richard: That was also my thinking. It does make sense. I want to display this belt without using a man sized manikin. So I got the idea of using a coat/hat stand and wraping the center post with bubble wrap to equal about 36" in diameter, and then covering the bubble wrap with red or blue material. Sounds a bit hoaky, but it would also allow me to display this belt, my other Afghan belt and cartridge bandolier, as well as hang my various horns and flasks. But maybe you guys have a better idea? Rick. Attached Images

1st February 2016, 02:41 AM	#12
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	Yep Sounds good. Rather than bubble wrap what about a large diam cardboard or plastic tube and cover that with fabric. Seems to me you would need a large amount of bubble wrap to get to 36"!! ]

1st February 2016, 02:57 AM	#13
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	Hi Stu. I somewhat mis-spoke. I should have said that equal to about a 36" belt size to equal an average man's waist size. LOL So it would not be that much bubble wrap. Yes, the cardboard tube or plastic pipe (pvc pipe) could work. But I thought the bubble wrap idea was good since it would be very light weight and offer some "flex" to snug the belts up and help to keep the belts from sliding downwards. And as long as I'm at it, I could add this Choora/Pesh Kabz to the belt accessories? What do you think ? Rick. Attached Images

1st February 2016, 03:25 AM	#14
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	Hi Rick, Nice looking Pesh/Choora. I suspect by the look of it that the scabbard is much newer than the knife. Scabbards are usually decorated but this looks plain. Also is that machine stitching along the bottom? The Pesh/Choora knife would certainly be in keeping with the belt and you will now also need to add a Khyber Knife (Salawar) to the rig. Looks as if you are going to start collecting blades by default!

1st February 2016, 12:22 PM	#15
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	Hi Stu. Yes, it looks like machine stiching to me. It appears to be an older scabbard with a much latter leather cover. The blade itself is still strong and sharp. Rick.

1st February 2016, 01:03 PM	#16
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,079	What struck me was how closely the buckle and other bits resembled the fittings on a Roman military belt of the first Century AD. Attached Images

1st February 2016, 01:23 PM	#17
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	David, I think that you are more than right. I had the same thought with the Caucasian belt, so Roman for me. And I don't talk about the Kindjal and the Roman gladius... I guess Romans stroke the Caucasian / Central Asian traditions (including Rick's belt, that I suspect to be from Northern Afghanistan). Kubur Attached Images

1st February 2016, 01:29 PM	#18
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	more clear Attached Images

6th February 2016, 06:55 PM	#19
rickystl Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO area. Posts: 1,623	Thank you all for your interest and comments. Much appreciated. I'll let you know how the coat rack stand idea works out. LOL. It will at least allow me to display a bunch of items in one corner. Rick.