two different yataghans,place of origin ID and translation

SERGIU · 27th January 2012, 03:58 PM

I really want to verify my opinion about these two items, as here seems to be the only place where identifications are 100% accurate. Here, both are called crnosapac (black grips) but places of origin seem not to be around Banat or Balkans.

is the one with inscriptions on the blade and small ears anatolian? Is it true that the maker of the inscription runned out of space and the words are incomplete? your opinion will be very apreciated, along with the translation.

is the other, without ears on the grip and no ornament at all, north african? or janissary/pandur issue?

thank you

TVV · 27th January 2012, 06:46 PM

Hi Sergiu,
The top yataghan with the engraved balde looks Balkan to me. The ears, even though a little smaller, and the form and decoration of the bolster and the hilt band are certainly Balkan. I know in her book Astvatsaturian places this type of blade in Eastern Anatolia, but she admits that she does not have any firm evidence for this, and does this based on the niello decoration on the hilts that many of these engraved blades come with. One needs to keep in mind that within the Ottoman Empire there was a considerable trading activity in all kinds of blades, including yataghan blades, which were hilted according to local preferences. It is difficult to guarantee a 100% accuracy of this identification, but I think the first yataghan is Balkan and probably from the Southern or Easterm parts of the peninsula.
The tri-lobate ears on the second one are a style associated with Northern Africa. The simple brass bolster may be later to the blade and perhaps to the hilt as well.
Regards,
Teodor

SERGIU · 28th January 2012, 12:27 PM

TVV thank you , I knew that posting here will bring very useful informations.
Request upon style of engraving and translation remains. please

27th January 2012, 03:58 PM	#1
SERGIU Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Timisoara, Romania Posts: 32	two different yataghans,place of origin ID and translation I really want to verify my opinion about these two items, as here seems to be the only place where identifications are 100% accurate. Here, both are called crnosapac (black grips) but places of origin seem not to be around Banat or Balkans. is the one with inscriptions on the blade and small ears anatolian? Is it true that the maker of the inscription runned out of space and the words are incomplete? your opinion will be very apreciated, along with the translation. is the other, without ears on the grip and no ornament at all, north african? or janissary/pandur issue? thank you Attached Images

27th January 2012, 06:46 PM	#2
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,624	Hi Sergiu, The top yataghan with the engraved balde looks Balkan to me. The ears, even though a little smaller, and the form and decoration of the bolster and the hilt band are certainly Balkan. I know in her book Astvatsaturian places this type of blade in Eastern Anatolia, but she admits that she does not have any firm evidence for this, and does this based on the niello decoration on the hilts that many of these engraved blades come with. One needs to keep in mind that within the Ottoman Empire there was a considerable trading activity in all kinds of blades, including yataghan blades, which were hilted according to local preferences. It is difficult to guarantee a 100% accuracy of this identification, but I think the first yataghan is Balkan and probably from the Southern or Easterm parts of the peninsula. The tri-lobate ears on the second one are a style associated with Northern Africa. The simple brass bolster may be later to the blade and perhaps to the hilt as well. Regards, Teodor

28th January 2012, 12:27 PM	#3
SERGIU Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Timisoara, Romania Posts: 32	TVV thank you , I knew that posting here will bring very useful informations. Request upon style of engraving and translation remains. please