Spear?

aspalathos · 10th April 2023, 03:33 PM

Need help,opinion please .

CSinTX · 11th April 2023, 02:20 PM

Opinion, looks to be a fairly recently made one off.

kronckew · 11th April 2023, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSinTX

Opinion, looks to be a fairly recently made one off.

For our edification, Why do you say that?

Raf · 11th April 2023, 09:15 PM

Boar spear . Looks ok to me. Interesting that they were also considered a fighting weapon.

Akanthus · 11th April 2023, 10:58 PM

Normally the rectangular part of boarfeathers is part of the shaft and tied to it.It is mostly not a part of the blade .It should prevent that the blade penetrating too deep in the wildboars body.If it's old, for me the spear is a simple weapon for use in a revolt ,for example in the peasant wars.At that time the bkacksmithes created simple but effective weapons often by changing agricultural tools.Pehaps it is a later collector weapon ,that should remember of those times

Radboud · 11th April 2023, 11:11 PM

Good people, looking at the photo of it in Aspalathos' hand, the blade appears too short to be a functional weapon, especially not a boar spear that needs to punch through thick hide and a ribcage to get to the animal's heart.

From the crude forging overall and especially of the socket, while having a counter sunk hole for a securing screw, I suspect this to be a modern decorative piece.

aspalathos · 12th April 2023, 04:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aspalathos

Need help,opinion please .

photos

M ELEY · 12th April 2023, 05:14 PM

I think the piece shows appropriate age, but I know with blacksmith-made pieces, it's sometimes hard to tell. I know the crossguard points to a boar spear, but any possibility this could be a primitive spontoon? Colonial/frontier? It could easily pass as a Spanish colonial or even American Rev War piece. I am assuming you live in Europe, Aspalathos? Where did you acquire the piece?

Jim McDougall · 12th April 2023, 11:24 PM

Capn, Im not surprised your radar piqued (or should I say 'piked' ) on this one!
Trusty Neumann, "Swords and Blades of the American Revolution".
Though this shown is a European type of boarding pike, it is not a far reach to imagine a blacksmith in America fashioning one of these following that design for vessels in the fledgling Colonial Navy.

Much as with most polearms, the objective is not to impale the victim or opponent thus losing use of the weapon. With the Mexican Lancers at the Battle of San Pascual in California in 1846, the riders were using cibolero (buffalo hunting) type lances. The overrun American dragoons lost in the battle were all with multiple stabbing wounds, often as many as 16, indicating the jabbing method employed in attack.

As Neumann notes, the cross bars (resembling those of course on boar hunt weapons) were 'parrying hooks' as seen on two handers and many hunting polearms.

aspalathos · 13th April 2023, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M ELEY

I think the piece shows appropriate age, but I know with blacksmith-made pieces, it's sometimes hard to tell. I know the crossguard points to a boar spear, but any possibility this could be a primitive spontoon? Colonial/frontier? It could easily pass as a Spanish colonial or even American Rev War piece. I am assuming you live in Europe, Aspalathos? Where did you acquire the piece?

Hi,Croatia ,before comes from Sweden,before that Germany…but who knowes where it started from ….

M ELEY · 13th April 2023, 05:41 AM

Hello Jim and thanks for posting that. That's exactly what I was going for. I know it could be either, but the primitive seam on the side of the cap, the workmanship and the lack of langets just had me thinking a possible pike or spontoon of a more provincial quality. I'm not insulting the piece, BTW! I think it is an amazing example either way. I really like the hand-wrought types!

Raf · 13th April 2023, 02:07 PM

If its old , which it appears to be and looks like a boar spear then that’s probably what it is . The defining characteristics of a boar spear are the wide side bars , as opposed to the lugged spear as in the example illustrated above . A style which goes back to the early medieval period and beyond. The side bars are absolutely necessary to stop the injured boar impaling itself on the spear and savaging its attacker. They must have been an essential hunting tool and although decorative examples do exist the majority were probably simple blacksmith made with no more attention lavished on them than any other agricultural implement . As such I would have thought this is a rare survival that deserves to be celebrated.

Like billhooks they had potential as an extemporised weapon.

From Paulus Hector Mair 1517 – 1579) . German aristocrat, civil servant, and fencer. The boar spear:versus the halberd.

'take his thrust away with your blade on your left side. In that moment, follow in after with your left leg and stab him in his nuts.'

Halberd owners beware
.

10th April 2023, 03:33 PM	#1
aspalathos Member Join Date: Nov 2019 Posts: 97	Spear? Need help,opinion please . Attached Images

11th April 2023, 09:15 PM	#4
Raf Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 252	Boar spear . Looks ok to me. Interesting that they were also considered a fighting weapon. Attached Images

12th April 2023, 11:24 PM	#9
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,954	Capn, Im not surprised your radar piqued (or should I say 'piked' ) on this one! Trusty Neumann, "Swords and Blades of the American Revolution". Though this shown is a European type of boarding pike, it is not a far reach to imagine a blacksmith in America fashioning one of these following that design for vessels in the fledgling Colonial Navy. Much as with most polearms, the objective is not to impale the victim or opponent thus losing use of the weapon. With the Mexican Lancers at the Battle of San Pascual in California in 1846, the riders were using cibolero (buffalo hunting) type lances. The overrun American dragoons lost in the battle were all with multiple stabbing wounds, often as many as 16, indicating the jabbing method employed in attack. As Neumann notes, the cross bars (resembling those of course on boar hunt weapons) were 'parrying hooks' as seen on two handers and many hunting polearms. Attached Images Last edited by Jim McDougall; 13th April 2023 at 04:56 PM.

11th April 2023, 02:20 PM	#2
CSinTX Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Posts: 233	Opinion, looks to be a fairly recently made one off.

11th April 2023, 10:58 PM	#5
Akanthus Member Join Date: Mar 2023 Posts: 76	Normally the rectangular part of boarfeathers is part of the shaft and tied to it.It is mostly not a part of the blade .It should prevent that the blade penetrating too deep in the wildboars body.If it's old, for me the spear is a simple weapon for use in a revolt ,for example in the peasant wars.At that time the bkacksmithes created simple but effective weapons often by changing agricultural tools.Pehaps it is a later collector weapon ,that should remember of those times

11th April 2023, 11:11 PM	#6
Radboud Member Join Date: Sep 2021 Location: New Zealand Posts: 261	Good people, looking at the photo of it in Aspalathos' hand, the blade appears too short to be a functional weapon, especially not a boar spear that needs to punch through thick hide and a ribcage to get to the animal's heart. From the crude forging overall and especially of the socket, while having a counter sunk hole for a securing screw, I suspect this to be a modern decorative piece.

12th April 2023, 05:14 PM	#8
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,101	I think the piece shows appropriate age, but I know with blacksmith-made pieces, it's sometimes hard to tell. I know the crossguard points to a boar spear, but any possibility this could be a primitive spontoon? Colonial/frontier? It could easily pass as a Spanish colonial or even American Rev War piece. I am assuming you live in Europe, Aspalathos? Where did you acquire the piece?

13th April 2023, 05:41 AM	#11
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,101	Hello Jim and thanks for posting that. That's exactly what I was going for. I know it could be either, but the primitive seam on the side of the cap, the workmanship and the lack of langets just had me thinking a possible pike or spontoon of a more provincial quality. I'm not insulting the piece, BTW! I think it is an amazing example either way. I really like the hand-wrought types!

13th April 2023, 02:07 PM	#12
Raf Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 252	If its old , which it appears to be and looks like a boar spear then that’s probably what it is . The defining characteristics of a boar spear are the wide side bars , as opposed to the lugged spear as in the example illustrated above . A style which goes back to the early medieval period and beyond. The side bars are absolutely necessary to stop the injured boar impaling itself on the spear and savaging its attacker. They must have been an essential hunting tool and although decorative examples do exist the majority were probably simple blacksmith made with no more attention lavished on them than any other agricultural implement . As such I would have thought this is a rare survival that deserves to be celebrated. Like billhooks they had potential as an extemporised weapon. From Paulus Hector Mair 1517 – 1579) . German aristocrat, civil servant, and fencer. The boar spear:versus the halberd. 'take his thrust away with your blade on your left side. In that moment, follow in after with your left leg and stab him in his nuts.' Halberd owners beware .