Spanish sword

Victrix · 3rd December 2017, 10:31 PM

I would be grateful for any comments on this sword which looks like a Spanish espada de conchas although it was found in Italy. The sword’s overall length is 108cm, with the blade 91,5cm long and 2.5cm wide at the forte. The grip is covered in brown leather. The S-shaped quillons and knuckle guard have characteristic trumpet like ends, which is repeated on the pinhead shaped pommel. Both sides of the ricasso are stamped with a cartouche containing what appears to be a fleur-de-lis under a crown, which is supposedly the mark of Juan Martinez of Toledo. The sword is fairly plain but has a decorated guarda de polvo at the bottom of the conchas. The blade is fairly wide and flexible, with a rounded tip. It has a distinctive central fuller. Could it be a Solingen copy of a Toledo blade?

Hotspur · 4th December 2017, 05:47 PM

Some previous discussion with more photos
http://www.swordforum.com/forums/sho...-Spanish-sword

Cheers

GC

Victrix · 4th December 2017, 06:14 PM

Grateful for any constructive comments in this forum regarding this sword. Anyone recognize the style, time period, marks, etc?

fernando · 4th December 2017, 07:38 PM

Hello Victrix,
Let us see that comments on your sword are technicaly constructive as you wish. However be sure that members participation yes, is certainly constructive.
I gather that you know for yourself that Juan Martinez has no longer lived in the time this sword was produced. So the mark in the ricasso is either from a different smith or a simulation; or even a Toledo (TO) mark applied by German smiths, from where your blade might have come.
This 18th century Cavalry sword model, traditionally called Boca de Caballo, basically so due to its horse mouth aspect, has a comprehensive description in the following article:
http://www.catalogacionarmas.com/public/49-Conchas.pdf

By the way, you certainly have a copy of the Palomares Nomina; a work on the marks and names of Toledo sword smiths ...

.

Victrix · 4th December 2017, 08:35 PM

Many thanks for that, Fernando. I guess I was just curious if someone recognized the distinctive trumpet ends on the quillon and the pommel head? Or the distinctive pin head shaped pommel, or the fuller? I believe Naples and Milan were part of the Spanish crown in old days. Also the concha shell guard on one side seems quite large compared to similar swords. The blade could be older than the sword, but the fuller looks slightly Germanic to me I must admit. I’m curious about the rounded tip which makes it unlikely that this sword was used as a rapier although the tip is quite flexible like a spring rather than rigid. So many questions in my mind.

Many thanks for the article on the Spanish swords. I will try to run it through the google translator.

Victrix · 5th December 2017, 01:53 PM

Same, but different?

3rd December 2017, 10:31 PM	#1
Victrix Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Sweden Posts: 712	Spanish sword I would be grateful for any comments on this sword which looks like a Spanish espada de conchas although it was found in Italy. The sword’s overall length is 108cm, with the blade 91,5cm long and 2.5cm wide at the forte. The grip is covered in brown leather. The S-shaped quillons and knuckle guard have characteristic trumpet like ends, which is repeated on the pinhead shaped pommel. Both sides of the ricasso are stamped with a cartouche containing what appears to be a fleur-de-lis under a crown, which is supposedly the mark of Juan Martinez of Toledo. The sword is fairly plain but has a decorated guarda de polvo at the bottom of the conchas. The blade is fairly wide and flexible, with a rounded tip. It has a distinctive central fuller. Could it be a Solingen copy of a Toledo blade? Attached Images

4th December 2017, 07:38 PM	#4
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hello Victrix, Let us see that comments on your sword are technicaly constructive as you wish. However be sure that members participation yes, is certainly constructive. I gather that you know for yourself that Juan Martinez has no longer lived in the time this sword was produced. So the mark in the ricasso is either from a different smith or a simulation; or even a Toledo (TO) mark applied by German smiths, from where your blade might have come. This 18th century Cavalry sword model, traditionally called Boca de Caballo, basically so due to its horse mouth aspect, has a comprehensive description in the following article: http://www.catalogacionarmas.com/public/49-Conchas.pdf By the way, you certainly have a copy of the Palomares Nomina; a work on the marks and names of Toledo sword smiths ... . Attached Images Last edited by fernando; 4th December 2017 at 07:52 PM.

5th December 2017, 01:53 PM	#6
Victrix Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Sweden Posts: 712	Same, but different? Attached Images

4th December 2017, 05:47 PM	#2
Hotspur Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Nipmuc USA Posts: 499	Some previous discussion with more photos http://www.swordforum.com/forums/sho...-Spanish-sword Cheers GC

4th December 2017, 06:14 PM	#3
Victrix Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Sweden Posts: 712	Grateful for any constructive comments in this forum regarding this sword. Anyone recognize the style, time period, marks, etc?

4th December 2017, 08:35 PM	#5
Victrix Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Sweden Posts: 712	Many thanks for that, Fernando. I guess I was just curious if someone recognized the distinctive trumpet ends on the quillon and the pommel head? Or the distinctive pin head shaped pommel, or the fuller? I believe Naples and Milan were part of the Spanish crown in old days. Also the concha shell guard on one side seems quite large compared to similar swords. The blade could be older than the sword, but the fuller looks slightly Germanic to me I must admit. I’m curious about the rounded tip which makes it unlikely that this sword was used as a rapier although the tip is quite flexible like a spring rather than rigid. So many questions in my mind. Many thanks for the article on the Spanish swords. I will try to run it through the google translator.