Den Pasar Museum

A. G. Maisey · 6th March 2011, 10:43 PM

In December last year I went to Indonesia for a couple of months. I normally go into Indonesia via Bali , stay there a few days, then go up to Solo.

While I was in Bali I took the opportunity to make as complete a photographic record of the Den Pasar Museum as I was able. I did this because last year I had been told that the Indonesian Government has intentions of making a major grant to the Bali Government for the purpose of renovation or rebuilding of the Den Pasar Museum.

The Den Pasar Museum is its own exhibit. I think it was finished in 1939, and it was designed to show the various building styles of the regions of Bali. The museum is set in a series of courtyards that you enter and exit by way of steps through a gateway, so each display pavilion is a separate regional building in its own courtyard.It is worth a visit just to look at the buildings and courtyards.

Anyway, when I heard about this grant I immediately became fearful that this wonderful and unique museum would be replaced by a modern monstrosity of stainless steel and glass. So I decided to get as many pics of it as I could during my next visit.

So what has this got to do with keris?

Use this link, and on page 2 you will find pictures of every weapon that is on display in the Museum.

http://kerisattosanaji.com/Denpasarmuseum.html

Regrettably not a lot of weapons, even less keris, and not particularly wonderful photographs, but better than nothing, especially if there is no immediate prospect of a visit to Bali.

David · 6th March 2011, 10:47 PM

Thanks Alan. I understand your fear. Hopefully the grant money will be used wisely.

A. G. Maisey · 7th March 2011, 12:15 AM

Hopefully David, but I have my doubts.

Going back a few years we had a wonderful museum here in Sydney.

It was the Museum of Applied Arts and Sciences. It was housed in a beautiful old Victorian building, and it had some absolutely wonderful displays.

It was typically 19th century, and visit there took you back into the 19th century. It was exactly what a museum of this type should be.

Our bureaucrats did not see this museum in quite the same way as did the people who regularly used it.

The Museum of Applied Arts and Sciences was closed and in its place we got the Power House Museum, which is a modern museum that functions as a dumbed down child minding facility.Since its opening I have heard a stream of negative comments about it from all classes of people and for a wide range of reasons.

But it does entertain children very well.

I am more than a little afraid that a similar fate to that which befell the old Museum of Applied Arts and Sciences will befall the Den Pasar Museum.

I really do hope I'm wrong.

Gavin Nugent · 7th March 2011, 04:20 AM

Thank you for sharing the link Alan.

It would be a shame to see this establishment moved to another location, it is a beautiful setting with a lot of history in the immeadiate surroundings and if you have a historically versed companion who can point out various locations and explain what happened and when etc it is all that much more interesting.

Changed happened to the old QLD musuem in Brisbane, I remember as a child the smell of old displays and every time I see the 'Mummy' on TV and the adventurer's estate I remember the old QLD museum. I loved the place!
Whilst modern aspects and interaction for the kids of today is important, I think the old world style leaves more of an imprint in anyone.
Now it is all modern and sitting at South Bank Brisbane and all the really good old stuff is gone to the back rooms and weapons, HA!!! All gone in the last two years too.
Of course the Social History Curator is very helpful with supplying spreadsheets and appointments can be had to view any item you wish but it just isn't the same...another wonderful historical aspect of old world museums gone.....

I too have many images images of the complete collection on display available if further examples are required by anyone.

I have always wanted to know more about the large 'Lurus' labeled Keris but have never asked thus far so I ask Alan, if appropriate in this thread, can you explain it's past? Any information on this piece would be greatly appreciated if shared.
I think there are a good many threads that could be started on many of the aspects seen in the Keris in Den Pasar such as the Keris holders of the 19th centruy that many disgard as a non traditional items.
Another of interest is the Keris that reminds me of the Italian Cinquedea on a Keris scale, lovely form, lovely fullers.

Gav

Rick · 7th March 2011, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freebooter

I have always wanted to know more about the large 'Lurus' labeled Keris but have never asked thus far so I ask Alan, if appropriate in this thread, can you explain it's past? Any information on this piece would be greatly appreciated if shared.
I think there are a good many threads that could be started on many of the aspects seen in the Keris in Den Pasar such as the Keris holders of the 19th centruy that many disgard as a non traditional items.
Another of interest is the Keris that reminds me of the Italian Cinquedea on a Keris scale, lovely form, lovely fullers.

Gav

Hi Gav,
If we're talking about the same 'Lurus' ; I think it's a keris pedang .. In one of Alan's photos I think I can see where the upper edge seems to show the transition point from dull to sharp .

Maybe it's an optical delusion .

Gavin Nugent · 7th March 2011, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Hi Gav,
If we're talking about the same 'Lurus' ; I think it's a keris pedang .. In one of Alan's photos I think I can see where the upper edge seems to show the transition point from dull to sharp .

Maybe it's an optical delusion .

Optical I think Rick. The top edge has a beveled edge all the way to the tip. Here is another close up.

Gav

Gavin Nugent · 7th March 2011, 04:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Thanks Alan. I understand your fear. Hopefully the grant money will be used wisely.

If anything I hope the money is used to improve security and protect the collection. Despite out of date cameras, anyone can open most of the sliding glass doors and gain access to the items...I know I was not questioned when I slid open a panel to get a good clear flash shot of some pieces....This is where any money would benefit the museum.

Gav

A. G. Maisey · 7th March 2011, 04:56 AM

How long ago were you able to open the cabinets Gav?

The ones I tried will not open now.

I did something like 1000 images of this museum,I photographed everything inside and outside that I could point a camera at, but all I've provided in my site is a sample. If I get sufficient interest I might put up a few more pics, but essentially this site of mine, and this Forum, are about weaponry, rather than architecture and sarcophagi, so I reckon what's there is sufficient for the moment.

I asked about info on the keris on display two years ago, and I could not find anybody on the staff who knew anything at all.

The "cinquadea" type keris is a pretty scarce type. I have two, but I've only ever seen four altogether.

Gavin Nugent · 7th March 2011, 05:11 AM

Hi Alan,

I had two cabinets open for quite a while at the end of 2010.
I may not have been seen or it may have been that as I had my partner, children and a Balinese friend with me that no one came rushing in or I just looked plain honest and friendly with only an enquiring mind and a camera working overtime.
A lot were sealed tight with no access though, others I thought it would be too bold to do so further as I did want to see the whole museum without ticking of officials.

It seems we had the same approach with photography too. I climbed one of those steep stair cases and took a few ariel shots...nice and cool in the breeze too.

I agree you covered the limited amount of weapons very well.
One however that sticks in my mind was in the theatre abode, the theatric shield with the long central spike, I kind of wondered if there was historical aspects of real use based around its manufacture?

It is a shame there is nothing noted of the 'Lurus' keris it is a stunner and although I didn't get close enough, it appeared one aspect was hollowed/pierced. great form, great size, great desire to handle one.
The other above had 15luks from memory, something else I have never seen before on a Bali Keris.

You are a lucky man to own 2 'cinquadea' style Keris, they are indeed gorgeous.

Gav

A. G. Maisey · 7th March 2011, 06:08 AM

This the two keris you mean?

I think the straight one is probably Bali/Lombok. Looks like the gandhik has been pierced, and they do unusual stuff like on Lombok keris fairly often.

The other waved one I don't find unusual. Nice keris, but not unusual.

Yes, the multi-fullered keris are pretty nice, but they didn't come cheap. I got the first one in Australia years ago at a shop in the Rocks, the other one came as part of a deal. I saw one in Celuk a couple years back too, and would have bought it, but the seller was just being ridiculous with his price, so I let him keep it since he apparently liked it so much.

Jussi M. · 7th March 2011, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

If I get sufficient interest I might put up a few more pics, but essentially this site of mine, and this Forum, are about weaponry, rather than architecture and sarcophagi, so I reckon what's there is sufficient for the moment.

Well... Both architecture and sarcophagi are artifacts of the same culture(s) that gave birth and nurtured the keris as we encounter it today so it would not be off the mark to have more insight to them.

Just my opinion of course but it is understandable if the answer is "no" as putting those files up and running takes considerable time which is a scarce commodity.

That said, and to be clear, I vote yes. Please.

Thanks,

J.

David · 8th March 2011, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

The "cinquadea" type keris is a pretty scarce type. I have two, but I've only ever seen four altogether.

Would i be correct that the "cinquadea" type keris is #12. Instead of describing it that way i would be more inclined to see it as a Balinese take on a keris sepang. I have never seen one like this. Do you know much about these Alan? Does this type of keris serve the same "purpose" as keris sepang? I'd say you are fortunate to have 2 of these in your possession.

A. G. Maisey · 8th March 2011, 08:18 AM

Yeah, its valid to call it a sepang. I just followed Gav's lead, and as a general rule I don't really care too much about what anybody calls something, as long as we understand one another.

I do not know anything about them except that they are exceptionally rare. My two are quite heavy, substantial pieces, but I do not know where they come from, what period, Balinese name, who used them,nor anything else.

Incidentally, those photos were taken with a Canon 980 IS. This is a little P&S shirt pocket camera. In virtually all the inside shots the light was incredibly poor. I have never been so satisfied with any camera that I've owned, and I've owned a few.

7th March 2011, 04:20 AM	#4
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Thank you for sharing the link Alan. It would be a shame to see this establishment moved to another location, it is a beautiful setting with a lot of history in the immeadiate surroundings and if you have a historically versed companion who can point out various locations and explain what happened and when etc it is all that much more interesting. Changed happened to the old QLD musuem in Brisbane, I remember as a child the smell of old displays and every time I see the 'Mummy' on TV and the adventurer's estate I remember the old QLD museum. I loved the place! Whilst modern aspects and interaction for the kids of today is important, I think the old world style leaves more of an imprint in anyone. Now it is all modern and sitting at South Bank Brisbane and all the really good old stuff is gone to the back rooms and weapons, HA!!! All gone in the last two years too. Of course the Social History Curator is very helpful with supplying spreadsheets and appointments can be had to view any item you wish but it just isn't the same...another wonderful historical aspect of old world museums gone..... I too have many images images of the complete collection on display available if further examples are required by anyone. I have always wanted to know more about the large 'Lurus' labeled Keris but have never asked thus far so I ask Alan, if appropriate in this thread, can you explain it's past? Any information on this piece would be greatly appreciated if shared. I think there are a good many threads that could be started on many of the aspects seen in the Keris in Den Pasar such as the Keris holders of the 19th centruy that many disgard as a non traditional items. Another of interest is the Keris that reminds me of the Italian Cinquedea on a Keris scale, lovely form, lovely fullers. Gav Last edited by freebooter; 7th March 2011 at 04:57 AM.

7th March 2011, 05:11 AM	#9
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Hi Alan, I had two cabinets open for quite a while at the end of 2010. I may not have been seen or it may have been that as I had my partner, children and a Balinese friend with me that no one came rushing in or I just looked plain honest and friendly with only an enquiring mind and a camera working overtime. A lot were sealed tight with no access though, others I thought it would be too bold to do so further as I did want to see the whole museum without ticking of officials. It seems we had the same approach with photography too. I climbed one of those steep stair cases and took a few ariel shots...nice and cool in the breeze too. I agree you covered the limited amount of weapons very well. One however that sticks in my mind was in the theatre abode, the theatric shield with the long central spike, I kind of wondered if there was historical aspects of real use based around its manufacture? It is a shame there is nothing noted of the 'Lurus' keris it is a stunner and although I didn't get close enough, it appeared one aspect was hollowed/pierced. great form, great size, great desire to handle one. The other above had 15luks from memory, something else I have never seen before on a Bali Keris. You are a lucky man to own 2 'cinquadea' style Keris, they are indeed gorgeous. Gav Last edited by freebooter; 7th March 2011 at 05:30 AM.

7th March 2011, 06:08 AM	#10
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,890	This the two keris you mean? I think the straight one is probably Bali/Lombok. Looks like the gandhik has been pierced, and they do unusual stuff like on Lombok keris fairly often. The other waved one I don't find unusual. Nice keris, but not unusual. Yes, the multi-fullered keris are pretty nice, but they didn't come cheap. I got the first one in Australia years ago at a shop in the Rocks, the other one came as part of a deal. I saw one in Celuk a couple years back too, and would have bought it, but the seller was just being ridiculous with his price, so I let him keep it since he apparently liked it so much. Attached Images

6th March 2011, 10:43 PM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,890	Den Pasar Museum In December last year I went to Indonesia for a couple of months. I normally go into Indonesia via Bali , stay there a few days, then go up to Solo. While I was in Bali I took the opportunity to make as complete a photographic record of the Den Pasar Museum as I was able. I did this because last year I had been told that the Indonesian Government has intentions of making a major grant to the Bali Government for the purpose of renovation or rebuilding of the Den Pasar Museum. The Den Pasar Museum is its own exhibit. I think it was finished in 1939, and it was designed to show the various building styles of the regions of Bali. The museum is set in a series of courtyards that you enter and exit by way of steps through a gateway, so each display pavilion is a separate regional building in its own courtyard.It is worth a visit just to look at the buildings and courtyards. Anyway, when I heard about this grant I immediately became fearful that this wonderful and unique museum would be replaced by a modern monstrosity of stainless steel and glass. So I decided to get as many pics of it as I could during my next visit. So what has this got to do with keris? Use this link, and on page 2 you will find pictures of every weapon that is on display in the Museum. http://kerisattosanaji.com/Denpasarmuseum.html Regrettably not a lot of weapons, even less keris, and not particularly wonderful photographs, but better than nothing, especially if there is no immediate prospect of a visit to Bali.

6th March 2011, 10:47 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,121	Thanks Alan. I understand your fear. Hopefully the grant money will be used wisely.

7th March 2011, 12:15 AM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,890	Hopefully David, but I have my doubts. Going back a few years we had a wonderful museum here in Sydney. It was the Museum of Applied Arts and Sciences. It was housed in a beautiful old Victorian building, and it had some absolutely wonderful displays. It was typically 19th century, and visit there took you back into the 19th century. It was exactly what a museum of this type should be. Our bureaucrats did not see this museum in quite the same way as did the people who regularly used it. The Museum of Applied Arts and Sciences was closed and in its place we got the Power House Museum, which is a modern museum that functions as a dumbed down child minding facility.Since its opening I have heard a stream of negative comments about it from all classes of people and for a wide range of reasons. But it does entertain children very well. I am more than a little afraid that a similar fate to that which befell the old Museum of Applied Arts and Sciences will befall the Den Pasar Museum. I really do hope I'm wrong.

7th March 2011, 04:56 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,890	How long ago were you able to open the cabinets Gav? The ones I tried will not open now. I did something like 1000 images of this museum,I photographed everything inside and outside that I could point a camera at, but all I've provided in my site is a sample. If I get sufficient interest I might put up a few more pics, but essentially this site of mine, and this Forum, are about weaponry, rather than architecture and sarcophagi, so I reckon what's there is sufficient for the moment. I asked about info on the keris on display two years ago, and I could not find anybody on the staff who knew anything at all. The "cinquadea" type keris is a pretty scarce type. I have two, but I've only ever seen four altogether.

8th March 2011, 08:18 AM	#13
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,890	Yeah, its valid to call it a sepang. I just followed Gav's lead, and as a general rule I don't really care too much about what anybody calls something, as long as we understand one another. I do not know anything about them except that they are exceptionally rare. My two are quite heavy, substantial pieces, but I do not know where they come from, what period, Balinese name, who used them,nor anything else. Incidentally, those photos were taken with a Canon 980 IS. This is a little P&S shirt pocket camera. In virtually all the inside shots the light was incredibly poor. I have never been so satisfied with any camera that I've owned, and I've owned a few.