Tulwar Hilt Resin Substitute.

Norman McCormick · 26th May 2009, 03:25 PM

Hi,
Can anybody recommend a suitable substitute, that can be sourced in the U.K., for the resin used in Tulwar hilts. I read a previous post in which someone, I think, used hard setting modelling clay? All help appreciated.
Regards,
Norman.

Atlantia · 26th May 2009, 04:49 PM

Hi Norman.
It depends what you want to achieve. The original resin must be some natural substance, although I'm not sure what. I believe it is made malleable with heat, so if you wish to 'create' a substitute which has similar properties, then perhaps a base using some kind of D.I.Y roofing pitch/tar that sets hard (the type roofers use to lay flat roofing felt etc).
If you wish to achieve something more solid, then fibreglass resin is good.
However, I would caution that some experimenting is a good idea first as a handle full of set resin can be difficult to remove/alter.
Also, if using fibreglass resin, then I would add particulate matter to give it a more 'authentic' look.
I would suggest doing some experiments, for instance getting sawdust, sieving it to get the really fine particles then dyeing it with a thin wood dye, letting it dry and mixing it into the resin to get a better texture and colour.

A more simple and forgiving mixture would be the old wood glue and dyed sawdust mix, but it will take a while to dry.

Regards
Gene

Gt Obach · 26th May 2009, 04:55 PM

http://forums.dfoggknives.com/index....wtopic=1403&hl

should do the trick

Greg

G. McCormack · 26th May 2009, 06:32 PM

I'd recommend against anything non-reversible.

The cutlers resin recipe in Greg's link works great, smells great, is reversible, and is a historical method.

Good luck.

Dinggat · 27th May 2009, 10:00 PM

Sorry for hijacking this thread, but I have a few related questions. In this thread of mine I had asked how the blade of my Piso Podang is fixed in the hilt, but so far noone answered. I guess I have my answer right now.

But: So basically the tang is just "glued" into the hilt? Was that actually solid enough to be used in combat when such weapons were still used for that purpose? Tulwars (and associated weapons like the Piso Podang) have a pretty small tang compared to some other swords. Being held in place by a resin material seems quite fragile in my eyes.

katana · 27th May 2009, 10:17 PM

Hi Dinggat,
the resin used is more than adequate for battle ready swords and has added advantages over peened tangs. Ease of replacement blades or hilts, or the removal of the blade for repair ....and the shock absorbency that the resin provides.
Regards David

Rick · 28th May 2009, 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dinggat

Sorry for hijacking this thread, but I have a few related questions. In this thread of mine I had asked how the blade of my Piso Podang is fixed in the hilt, but so far noone answered. I guess I have my answer right now.

But: So basically the tang is just "glued" into the hilt? Was that actually solid enough to be used in combat when such weapons were still used for that purpose? Tulwars (and associated weapons like the Piso Podang) have a pretty small tang compared to some other swords. Being held in place by a resin material seems quite fragile in my eyes.

Humans are fairly soft .

Norman McCormick · 28th May 2009, 01:54 PM

Hi Guys,
Many thanks for all the help. One question, is 'pine resin' U.K. the same as 'pine pitch' U.S.? Thanks again.
My Regards,
Norman.

ariel · 28th May 2009, 07:56 PM

5 parts, 1 part... :-)

Is it by weight or by volume?

G. McCormack · 28th May 2009, 09:02 PM

Generally you'd measure it out by weight- some pitch/resin is dense, some is puffy, some is sticky, some like peanut brittle.
But at the end of the day, you have to remember what it is supposed to do, and fabricate your recipe to that.
Hotter climates will demand less beeswax, colder climates more- to cut down on brittleness.
Any particulate inclusion seems to help- I've never used historically accurate horse manure because I didnt want to be heating it up- so I've used bone dust, wood shavings, and sand (sand seems to be a common constituent of the resin used to hold tulwar blades in place)

It doesnt take much to make a mechanical lock, and keep a blade in a hilt. Its funny that today, knives are used less than at perhaps any other time, and they are also more overbuilt than ever before.

It doesnt need to be Full Tang to be Battle Ready

Norman McCormick · 28th May 2009, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G. McCormack

Generally you'd measure it out by weight- some pitch/resin is dense, some is puffy, some is sticky, some like peanut brittle.
But at the end of the day, you have to remember what it is supposed to do, and fabricate your recipe to that.
Hotter climates will demand less beeswax, colder climates more- to cut down on brittleness.
Any particulate inclusion seems to help- I've never used historically accurate horse manure because I didnt want to be heating it up- so I've used bone dust, wood shavings, and sand (sand seems to be a common constituent of the resin used to hold tulwar blades in place)

It doesnt take much to make a mechanical lock, and keep a blade in a hilt. Its funny that today, knives are used less than at perhaps any other time, and they are also more overbuilt than ever before.

It doesnt need to be Full Tang to be Battle Ready

Many thanks, everything is clear.
My Regards,
Norman

G. McCormack · 31st May 2009, 06:20 AM

If you make some, post some pics! ;-)

26th May 2009, 03:25 PM	#1
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,596	Tulwar Hilt Resin Substitute. Hi, Can anybody recommend a suitable substitute, that can be sourced in the U.K., for the resin used in Tulwar hilts. I read a previous post in which someone, I think, used hard setting modelling clay? All help appreciated. Regards, Norman.

28th May 2009, 09:02 PM	#10
G. McCormack Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 131	Generally you'd measure it out by weight- some pitch/resin is dense, some is puffy, some is sticky, some like peanut brittle. But at the end of the day, you have to remember what it is supposed to do, and fabricate your recipe to that. Hotter climates will demand less beeswax, colder climates more- to cut down on brittleness. Any particulate inclusion seems to help- I've never used historically accurate horse manure because I didnt want to be heating it up- so I've used bone dust, wood shavings, and sand (sand seems to be a common constituent of the resin used to hold tulwar blades in place) It doesnt take much to make a mechanical lock, and keep a blade in a hilt. Its funny that today, knives are used less than at perhaps any other time, and they are also more overbuilt than ever before. It doesnt need to be Full Tang to be Battle Ready Attached Images

26th May 2009, 04:49 PM	#2
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Hi Norman. It depends what you want to achieve. The original resin must be some natural substance, although I'm not sure what. I believe it is made malleable with heat, so if you wish to 'create' a substitute which has similar properties, then perhaps a base using some kind of D.I.Y roofing pitch/tar that sets hard (the type roofers use to lay flat roofing felt etc). If you wish to achieve something more solid, then fibreglass resin is good. However, I would caution that some experimenting is a good idea first as a handle full of set resin can be difficult to remove/alter. Also, if using fibreglass resin, then I would add particulate matter to give it a more 'authentic' look. I would suggest doing some experiments, for instance getting sawdust, sieving it to get the really fine particles then dyeing it with a thin wood dye, letting it dry and mixing it into the resin to get a better texture and colour. A more simple and forgiving mixture would be the old wood glue and dyed sawdust mix, but it will take a while to dry. Regards Gene

26th May 2009, 04:55 PM	#3
Gt Obach Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 116	http://forums.dfoggknives.com/index....wtopic=1403&hl should do the trick Greg

26th May 2009, 06:32 PM	#4
G. McCormack Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 131	I'd recommend against anything non-reversible. The cutlers resin recipe in Greg's link works great, smells great, is reversible, and is a historical method. Good luck.

27th May 2009, 10:00 PM	#5
Dinggat Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 29	Sorry for hijacking this thread, but I have a few related questions. In this thread of mine I had asked how the blade of my Piso Podang is fixed in the hilt, but so far noone answered. I guess I have my answer right now. But: So basically the tang is just "glued" into the hilt? Was that actually solid enough to be used in combat when such weapons were still used for that purpose? Tulwars (and associated weapons like the Piso Podang) have a pretty small tang compared to some other swords. Being held in place by a resin material seems quite fragile in my eyes.

27th May 2009, 10:17 PM	#6
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Hi Dinggat, the resin used is more than adequate for battle ready swords and has added advantages over peened tangs. Ease of replacement blades or hilts, or the removal of the blade for repair ....and the shock absorbency that the resin provides. Regards David

28th May 2009, 01:54 PM	#8
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,596	Hi Guys, Many thanks for all the help. One question, is 'pine resin' U.K. the same as 'pine pitch' U.S.? Thanks again. My Regards, Norman.

28th May 2009, 07:56 PM	#9
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	5 parts, 1 part... :-) Is it by weight or by volume?

31st May 2009, 06:20 AM	#12
G. McCormack Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 131	If you make some, post some pics! ;-)