Spear with cast iron ball end: Ideas please

Atlantia · 4th October 2011, 04:57 PM

Trying to help an offline friend Identify an unusual acquisition.
Sorry, no pictures as I wasn't expecting to see it when I went to see him and he's quite a way from here so I can't pop back with a camera.

A 'spear' with a hand forged slightly crude but very effective, heavy guage socketed spear head, with a single hole right through for attachment.
A thick (like a thick broom handle) shaft with a cast iron ball of 'cannon ball' size at the other end.
The ball has a hole right through it and an integral 'collar' where the shaft enters. There is a visible casing seam right around it.
Lots of dark old patina on the metalwork.

Here is my usual scribble to give you some idea.
The overall length is 4'3". It's very heavy and the POB is a handhold in front of the ball.

Jim McDougall · 4th October 2011, 07:33 PM

Decades ago when I was enthralled with the Charge of the Light Brigade, and Bengal Lancers and things British Raj, I was acquiring various lances of the cavalry units. If I recall correctly I acquired a pair of lances which were about this length and had bulbous leaden weights at the base. Im not sure of the size, but they could well have been the size of a small cannon ball.
These I understand were 'pig sticking' or hunting lances used by the British officers in India (they also developed polo in similar activities). An additional 'sport' they practiced in honing thier skills with the lance was called 'tent pegging' in which the rider used these lances to uproot the pegs in camp tents, which probably evolved out of tomfoolery. but still used considerable skill.
I think further research in these avenues might reveal more. If I recall (its been about 30 years) the book "Sword, Lance and Bayonet" I think by Hopkinson may have data. It was the benchmark for works by Wilkinson and Robson and I think written based on work by Bosquet (I think). I dont have any of these with me so hope this is some help.

All the best,
Jim

P.S. visions of these guys in India with pith helmets and jodhpuhrs with riding boots in the '30s.

Atlantia · 8th October 2011, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Decades ago when I was enthralled with the Charge of the Light Brigade, and Bengal Lancers and things British Raj, I was acquiring various lances of the cavalry units. If I recall correctly I acquired a pair of lances which were about this length and had bulbous leaden weights at the base. Im not sure of the size, but they could well have been the size of a small cannon ball.
These I understand were 'pig sticking' or hunting lances used by the British officers in India (they also developed polo in similar activities). An additional 'sport' they practiced in honing thier skills with the lance was called 'tent pegging' in which the rider used these lances to uproot the pegs in camp tents, which probably evolved out of tomfoolery. but still used considerable skill.
I think further research in these avenues might reveal more. If I recall (its been about 30 years) the book "Sword, Lance and Bayonet" I think by Hopkinson may have data. It was the benchmark for works by Wilkinson and Robson and I think written based on work by Bosquet (I think). I dont have any of these with me so hope this is some help.

All the best,
Jim

P.S. visions of these guys in India with pith helmets and jodhpuhrs with riding boots in the '30s.

Hi Jim,

Thanks mate, I'll have a google and see i I can find them.
Cheers
Gene

aiontay · 8th October 2011, 06:27 PM

i thought tent pegging originally came out of a Central Asian practice, and the practical application was for surprise attacks on camps where collaping the tents would trap/impede the occupants inside.

Jim McDougall · 8th October 2011, 07:44 PM

Thanks for the note Gene, hope you can find those. I'll check through what notes I have as well.
Good call Aiontay!! The British used thier interpretation of tent pegging in their cavalry units in the Northwest Frontier regions, which was indeed contiguous with Central Asia (Afghanistan and Uzbekistan). The sport of polo was derived similarly I believe from the 'Buzkhashi' which riders jockeyed to strike and propel a head of a goat across a field. Again those perceptions are based on recollections from some years ago, so corrections welcome.

4th October 2011, 04:57 PM	#1
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Spear with cast iron ball end: Ideas please Trying to help an offline friend Identify an unusual acquisition. Sorry, no pictures as I wasn't expecting to see it when I went to see him and he's quite a way from here so I can't pop back with a camera. A 'spear' with a hand forged slightly crude but very effective, heavy guage socketed spear head, with a single hole right through for attachment. A thick (like a thick broom handle) shaft with a cast iron ball of 'cannon ball' size at the other end. The ball has a hole right through it and an integral 'collar' where the shaft enters. There is a visible casing seam right around it. Lots of dark old patina on the metalwork. Here is my usual scribble to give you some idea. The overall length is 4'3". It's very heavy and the POB is a handhold in front of the ball. Attached Images

4th October 2011, 07:33 PM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,948	Decades ago when I was enthralled with the Charge of the Light Brigade, and Bengal Lancers and things British Raj, I was acquiring various lances of the cavalry units. If I recall correctly I acquired a pair of lances which were about this length and had bulbous leaden weights at the base. Im not sure of the size, but they could well have been the size of a small cannon ball. These I understand were 'pig sticking' or hunting lances used by the British officers in India (they also developed polo in similar activities). An additional 'sport' they practiced in honing thier skills with the lance was called 'tent pegging' in which the rider used these lances to uproot the pegs in camp tents, which probably evolved out of tomfoolery. but still used considerable skill. I think further research in these avenues might reveal more. If I recall (its been about 30 years) the book "Sword, Lance and Bayonet" I think by Hopkinson may have data. It was the benchmark for works by Wilkinson and Robson and I think written based on work by Bosquet (I think). I dont have any of these with me so hope this is some help. All the best, Jim P.S. visions of these guys in India with pith helmets and jodhpuhrs with riding boots in the '30s.

8th October 2011, 06:27 PM	#4
aiontay Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 88	i thought tent pegging originally came out of a Central Asian practice, and the practical application was for surprise attacks on camps where collaping the tents would trap/impede the occupants inside.

8th October 2011, 07:44 PM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,948	Thanks for the note Gene, hope you can find those. I'll check through what notes I have as well. Good call Aiontay!! The British used thier interpretation of tent pegging in their cavalry units in the Northwest Frontier regions, which was indeed contiguous with Central Asia (Afghanistan and Uzbekistan). The sport of polo was derived similarly I believe from the 'Buzkhashi' which riders jockeyed to strike and propel a head of a goat across a field. Again those perceptions are based on recollections from some years ago, so corrections welcome.