Unusual ? Moro kris

ariel · 25th December 2012, 12:06 AM

Not my area of knowledge or collection, but just out of interest.
This one just finished on e-bay. I would like to hear your opinions.
The blade looks to me reworked european. The top of the scabbard has nice decorations. The gangya is separate and the line is almost straight.
These are the features that drew my attention.
Was I right?
Should I have fought for it? Was it a sleeper for the New Year?

The files are too big. If anybody can resize them and put them here for posterity, I shall be grateful. ( If they are even worth showing here:-))

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-EARL...p2047675.l2557

Atlantia · 25th December 2012, 12:13 AM

Here you go

Atlantia · 25th December 2012, 12:15 AM

It's been scrubbed with sandpaper which is a shame.

The blade looks to me like it's a reused blade and the configuration of holes make me think it was once mounted as a large pata or possibly Firangi or similarly mounted blade with bars/mountings that are riveted to the blade.

ariel · 25th December 2012, 01:30 AM

First, thanks for your help with pics.
Very clever idea re. origin of holes. But, if so, it must be rather old, isn't it? To switch from the european blade to pata ( 19th cen at the latest), and then to move to Mindanao.

Battara · 25th December 2012, 04:23 AM

Lots of trade though in the region with India.......

Atlantia · 25th December 2012, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

First, thanks for your help with pics.
Very clever idea re. origin of holes. But, if so, it must be rather old, isn't it? To switch from the european blade to pata ( 19th cen at the latest), and then to move to Mindanao.

HI Ariel,
You are welcome.
I also have an interest in these 'anomalies' so it's always nice to see items like this one.

Sajen · 25th December 2012, 01:35 PM

Very intersting piece, thank you for posting. Haven't seen it!

Regards,

Detlef

Atlantia · 25th December 2012, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

First, thanks for your help with pics.
Very clever idea re. origin of holes. But, if so, it must be rather old, isn't it? To switch from the european blade to pata ( 19th cen at the latest), and then to move to Mindanao.

Hi Ariel,

Sorry, I meant to add the I don't see any reason why the blade couldn't be very old.
The surfaces have been reworked to make it into this incarnation and then it's been recently harshly cleaned hiding any signs of age by taking it all down to bare steel.

In one pic I can almost 'see' the outline of the reinforcing bracket over the blade, what do you think?

ariel · 25th December 2012, 02:27 PM

In my dilettante opinion, the entire wide part of the blade below the gangja was formed from a separate piece and the original blade was inserted and forged there.
If that was the case, I see no reason to see the holes in the original blade. No?

Also, I do not see the bracket; rather, it is a fuller, and it stops suddenly ~ 1/5 of the way from the gangya. That's one of the reasons I suggest the existence of a separate thick piece where the blade was inserted.

Spunjer · 25th December 2012, 02:38 PM

ariel, i don't think it was an indian blade. i think at one point that particular kris has that fancy plate at the widest part of the blade, belonging in the category of this particular piece: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15535
kino's example on post#7 appears to have rivets (albeit his has 4 of them going down. yours might have just two ). the profile of the blade appears to be similar to mine in which it has a slight overall curve, and if you notice, a single groove on the lower edge.
the handle on that is oriented the wrong way, btw...

adding kino's example as well.

25th December 2012, 12:06 AM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Unusual ? Moro kris Not my area of knowledge or collection, but just out of interest. This one just finished on e-bay. I would like to hear your opinions. The blade looks to me reworked european. The top of the scabbard has nice decorations. The gangya is separate and the line is almost straight. These are the features that drew my attention. Was I right? Should I have fought for it? Was it a sleeper for the New Year? The files are too big. If anybody can resize them and put them here for posterity, I shall be grateful. ( If they are even worth showing here:-)) http://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-EARL...p2047675.l2557

25th December 2012, 12:13 AM	#2
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Here you go Attached Images

25th December 2012, 12:15 AM	#3
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	It's been scrubbed with sandpaper which is a shame. The blade looks to me like it's a reused blade and the configuration of holes make me think it was once mounted as a large pata or possibly Firangi or similarly mounted blade with bars/mountings that are riveted to the blade. Attached Images Last edited by Atlantia; 25th December 2012 at 12:34 AM.

25th December 2012, 02:27 PM	#9
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	In my dilettante opinion, the entire wide part of the blade below the gangja was formed from a separate piece and the original blade was inserted and forged there. If that was the case, I see no reason to see the holes in the original blade. No? Also, I do not see the bracket; rather, it is a fuller, and it stops suddenly ~ 1/5 of the way from the gangya. That's one of the reasons I suggest the existence of a separate thick piece where the blade was inserted. Last edited by ariel; 25th December 2012 at 02:38 PM.

25th December 2012, 02:38 PM	#10
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	ariel, i don't think it was an indian blade. i think at one point that particular kris has that fancy plate at the widest part of the blade, belonging in the category of this particular piece: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15535 kino's example on post#7 appears to have rivets (albeit his has 4 of them going down. yours might have just two ). the profile of the blade appears to be similar to mine in which it has a slight overall curve, and if you notice, a single groove on the lower edge. the handle on that is oriented the wrong way, btw... adding kino's example as well. Attached Images

25th December 2012, 01:30 AM	#4
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	First, thanks for your help with pics. Very clever idea re. origin of holes. But, if so, it must be rather old, isn't it? To switch from the european blade to pata ( 19th cen at the latest), and then to move to Mindanao.

25th December 2012, 04:23 AM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,200	Lots of trade though in the region with India.......

25th December 2012, 01:35 PM	#7
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,732	Very intersting piece, thank you for posting. Haven't seen it! Regards, Detlef