3 northern Javanese hilts

BluErf · 28th January 2006, 10:55 AM

Three Pasisir Jawa wooden hilts, which have similar forms, but in my opinion, represent different subjects.

These hilts were frequently referred to as abstract representations of Ganesha, but I think there is more than just Ganesha.

The first set of photos represent Ganesha, with the obvious big elephant head, a trunk curled at the tip.

BluErf · 28th January 2006, 10:59 AM

The second set of photos is where things start to get a bit interesting. The big bulbous head is still there, but wait a minute -- the curled trunk is gone. What seems to be in its place looks like a beak. If you look from the bottom-up angle, the face seems to look like that of a bird. Garuda or Jatayu?

The interesting thing is that there is this 2 sets of concentric swirls on both sides of the hilt, beside the beak. This is also present in the first Ganesha hilt, though the number of swirls is much less concentrated.

BluErf · 28th January 2006, 11:04 AM

The third set of photos represent something which is a bit more distinctive from the first two. However, due to the 'appendage' joining the chin of the head to the body, it was again referred to as a Ganesha form. I thought it may not be so because the appendage is too thin to be an elephant trunk. Further more, the head is smaller than the other two, and in this case, actually spots a nice moustache. The moustache is a peculiarity of this hilt, but it sort of reinforced my opinion that this is not Ganesha, but some putri satu form.

Opinions?

BluErf · 28th January 2006, 11:11 AM

Just as an interesting comparison - an earlier thread of a suspected Pasisir Jawa hilt. The motifs are a bit different, though the form is very similar, especially to the third hilt above. Actually, the wood used all seem very similar too. I know this sounds kind of absurd, but I think you can differentiate where an item came from based on the material used. Even if it is the same type of wood (e.g. kemuning), the specimens from different regions look and feel different.

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=665

nechesh · 28th January 2006, 07:38 PM

Interesting observations Kai Wee. I have often thought that many of these vegetal motif Pasisir are all to easily classified into just a few catagories, like with the discussion we had on the Raksasa hilts. Still, i think it will be really difficult to pin these specific hilts down to more specific dieties or beings. I do see what you are talking about as the differences in these hilts, but i suppose it is also possible that these differences can be attributed to the varying degrees of abstaction that these forms have gone through. Hard to say for sure. Ah....what i would give for a time travel machine.

28th January 2006, 10:55 AM	#1
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	3 northern Javanese hilts Three Pasisir Jawa wooden hilts, which have similar forms, but in my opinion, represent different subjects. These hilts were frequently referred to as abstract representations of Ganesha, but I think there is more than just Ganesha. The first set of photos represent Ganesha, with the obvious big elephant head, a trunk curled at the tip. Attached Images

28th January 2006, 10:59 AM	#2
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	The second set of photos is where things start to get a bit interesting. The big bulbous head is still there, but wait a minute -- the curled trunk is gone. What seems to be in its place looks like a beak. If you look from the bottom-up angle, the face seems to look like that of a bird. Garuda or Jatayu? The interesting thing is that there is this 2 sets of concentric swirls on both sides of the hilt, beside the beak. This is also present in the first Ganesha hilt, though the number of swirls is much less concentrated. Attached Images

28th January 2006, 11:04 AM	#3
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	The third set of photos represent something which is a bit more distinctive from the first two. However, due to the 'appendage' joining the chin of the head to the body, it was again referred to as a Ganesha form. I thought it may not be so because the appendage is too thin to be an elephant trunk. Further more, the head is smaller than the other two, and in this case, actually spots a nice moustache. The moustache is a peculiarity of this hilt, but it sort of reinforced my opinion that this is not Ganesha, but some putri satu form. Opinions? Attached Images

28th January 2006, 11:11 AM	#4
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	Just as an interesting comparison - an earlier thread of a suspected Pasisir Jawa hilt. The motifs are a bit different, though the form is very similar, especially to the third hilt above. Actually, the wood used all seem very similar too. I know this sounds kind of absurd, but I think you can differentiate where an item came from based on the material used. Even if it is the same type of wood (e.g. kemuning), the specimens from different regions look and feel different. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=665

28th January 2006, 07:38 PM	#5
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Interesting observations Kai Wee. I have often thought that many of these vegetal motif Pasisir are all to easily classified into just a few catagories, like with the discussion we had on the Raksasa hilts. Still, i think it will be really difficult to pin these specific hilts down to more specific dieties or beings. I do see what you are talking about as the differences in these hilts, but i suppose it is also possible that these differences can be attributed to the varying degrees of abstaction that these forms have gone through. Hard to say for sure. Ah....what i would give for a time travel machine.