Yataghan translation

mariusgmioc · 15th February 2020, 05:29 PM

Hello,

Kwiatek or somebody elese, please help me with the translation of the text on this Yataghan!

Regards,

Marius

kwiatek · 15th February 2020, 08:00 PM

Normally the same Turkish poems come up again and again, but this is one I’ve never seen before as an inscription. I read it as:

بر اهلی [کذا] کامل اوسته قولی قربانی اول
خار ایچنده بتان غنچه گوله منت ایلمم

ابلیسک تعلیم اتدیکی یوله منت ایلمم
عربی ف[ا]رسی بلمیان دیله منت ایلمم

Bir ehl-i kamil usta kulu kurbanı ol
Hâr içinde biten gonca güle minnet eylemem

İblisin ta’lim ettiği yola minnet eylemem
Arabî Farsî bilmeyen dile minnet eylemem

“Be the slave of and sacrifice for a master who is from the people of perfection.
I am not grateful for the bud of a rose that ends in a thorn,

I am not grateful for a path that Satan has taught,
I am not grateful for a tongue that knows neither Arabic nor Persian.“

The last three lines are from a poem of Fuzuli (d. 1556). In fact they have been used as the lyrics for songs in Turkey called Minnet Eylemem (though the songwriters appear to have often misunderstood the meaning of the old Turkish).

Hope that helps

mariusgmioc · 15th February 2020, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwiatek

Hope that helps

Wow! Of course it helps! You made me very, very happy! and confirms my suspicion this is a Turkish made Yataghan.

Thank you very, very much!

kwiatek · 15th February 2020, 08:13 PM

Certainly from the Ottoman Empire.

You’re very welcome. Is nice to see an inscription of this kind I haven’t seen before. Thanks for posting

mariusgmioc · 15th February 2020, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwiatek

Certainly from the Ottoman Empire.

I had no doubts that it is from the Turkish Empire. However, I wanted to know where in the Turkish Empire was it made?! More exactly was it Turkey or the Balkans?!

As I found signs of wootz, I suspected that it was made in Turkey because I am not aware of Balkan smiths working wootz.

Now, the verses of an original Turkish poem seem to confirm my supposition, since if it were made in the Balkanns would have one of the more commonly used texts.

But this is only my rather far fetched speculation, as it is almost impossible to establish with certainty where it was made.

Thank you once again for your help!

PS: I have many Ottoman bldes and most likely i'll seek you help again.

kwiatek · 16th February 2020, 01:19 AM

I don’t think the poems can tell you whether it was made in Anatolia or the Balkans. Turkish poetry would have been read and understood by officers and dignitaries all over the Balkans, Aegean and Anatolia in this period

15th February 2020, 05:29 PM	#1
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,903	Yataghan translation Hello, Kwiatek or somebody elese, please help me with the translation of the text on this Yataghan! Regards, Marius Attached Images Last edited by mariusgmioc; 15th February 2020 at 06:44 PM.

15th February 2020, 08:00 PM	#2
kwiatek Member Join Date: May 2019 Posts: 153	Normally the same Turkish poems come up again and again, but this is one I’ve never seen before as an inscription. I read it as: بر اهلی [کذا] کامل اوسته قولی قربانی اول خار ایچنده بتان غنچه گوله منت ایلمم ابلیسک تعلیم اتدیکی یوله منت ایلمم عربی ف[ا]رسی بلمیان دیله منت ایلمم Bir ehl-i kamil usta kulu kurbanı ol Hâr içinde biten gonca güle minnet eylemem İblisin ta’lim ettiği yola minnet eylemem Arabî Farsî bilmeyen dile minnet eylemem “Be the slave of and sacrifice for a master who is from the people of perfection. I am not grateful for the bud of a rose that ends in a thorn, I am not grateful for a path that Satan has taught, I am not grateful for a tongue that knows neither Arabic nor Persian.“ The last three lines are from a poem of Fuzuli (d. 1556). In fact they have been used as the lyrics for songs in Turkey called Minnet Eylemem (though the songwriters appear to have often misunderstood the meaning of the old Turkish). Hope that helps

15th February 2020, 08:13 PM	#4
kwiatek Member Join Date: May 2019 Posts: 153	Certainly from the Ottoman Empire. You’re very welcome. Is nice to see an inscription of this kind I haven’t seen before. Thanks for posting

16th February 2020, 01:19 AM	#6
kwiatek Member Join Date: May 2019 Posts: 153	I don’t think the poems can tell you whether it was made in Anatolia or the Balkans. Turkish poetry would have been read and understood by officers and dignitaries all over the Balkans, Aegean and Anatolia in this period