MARKINGS ON A LANCE HEAD 1868 PATTERN

[asomotif]

Today I bought this lance head in pretty rusty condition.
The seller thought it was from India and pre 1900, but he obviously did not know this stuff and did not see the markings :-)

cleary it is stamped "1930" and "5" (may 1930 ?)

But from which country / which producer. any suggestions ?

Best regards,
Willem

[Jim McDougall]

There is no reason to think that 1930 is not a year, and while this is indeed a M1868 British head and shoe, these were actually superceded by an 1894 pattern which were different. However with India stores, the usual govt. stamps etc. were often not present with private contractors.

The stave on these was male bamboo approx. 12 ft. 5/8" but with difficulties in standardizing due to shortages in supply they actually made 7 head sizes and 4 shoe sizes.

While the lance was officially abolished in British service in 1927, they remained in use in India for many years later, even as parade items. I had the opportunity to visit Brig. Francis Ingall, the "Last of the Bengal Lancers" (his autobiography) where he told me of his charge of the 6th lancers near the Khyber in 1931.

"The British Lance", J.D. Chown, 'Canadian Journal of Arms Collecting", Vol.7, #3, Jan. 1974.

[asomotif]

Hello Jim,

Thank you for the information.

So this one is an Indian manufacture ?

I found other threads and websites mentioning 9 foot as the standard length.
You mention 12 foot. Was this the length used in India ?

Ps. male bamboo ? As in male vs. female ?

What do you think, should I clean it / remove the rust ?

Best regards,
Willem

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by asomotif

Hello Jim,

Thank you for the information.

So this one is an Indian manufacture ?

I found other threads and websites mentioning 9 foot as the standard length.
You mention 12 foot. Was this the length used in India ?

What do you think, should I clean it / remove the rust ?

Best regards,
Willem

You bet Willem!
It most likely is of British/Indian manufacture. During the Raj, there were numbers of armorers in various depots where such materials were produced. There was a period of time where 12 and even 15 ft. staffs were used, but these were found unmanageable and the 9 ft. was implemented. The absence of the usual acceptance stamps and markings suggest this as well.

I recall getting a pair of these back 'in the day' and driving 60 miles to the LAX airport to get them (air freight from London). In my excitement I neglected to consider that I was driving a Corvette!! Duh!
I took off the T-tops and thank heavens they were only 9 ft.!!!!
In the 'charge of the green corvette' down the 405 freeway with red and white pennons flying...….the Highway Patrol, aghast, of course dampened my panache' ...but let me continue home.

[Will M]

The lance butt appears different in profile than the British made ones that have a longer pointed tip. The ring around the butt might be made of two parts on yours?

[Will M]

Here is an RCD marked lance butt and holder. Marked A/RCD/34/F/28
The tip has an inspection mark and Enfield mark.

[kronckew]

'Male Bamboo' is actually a non-hollow slow growing sub-species of Dendrocalamus strictus, andwas much prized for lance and spear shafts in it's range. You can buy seeds online, but they do not grow well in the UK or similar climates.

[asomotif]

Originally Posted by kronckew

'Male Bamboo' is actually a non-hollow slow growing sub-species of Dendrocalamus strictus, andwas much prized for lance and spear shafts in it's range. You can buy seeds online, but they do not grow well in the UK or similar climates.

Growing my own shaft is not an option I see. :-)
Considering I will not use the lance , (frequently ) I think I will go and look for a normal bamboo shaft.

[Will M]

The type of bamboo for lances is "male bamboo" or "Calcutta bamboo".
This type is solid and not hollow and very stiff. The lance heads are numbered for size since bamboo does not grow to one size only.
I've read somewhere (can't recall) that sourcing this bamboo was not always easy to obtain for lances.

[kronckew]

Originally Posted by asomotif

Growing my own shaft is not an option I see. :-)
Considering I will not use the lance , (frequently ) I think I will go and look for a normal bamboo shaft.

Europeans used Ash for spears, pikes and lances for millennia. with some artistic skill, you could probably make it look bambooish via staining, at least from a distance, I'm surprised eBay or Amazon do not carry male bamboo for lances.

Anyway, I found a source for y'all who want to be authentic: http://www.calcuttabamboopole.com/poles.html

Minimum order 3000 pieces, If your cavalry is more numerous, there is a max of 30000 pieces.

Apparently still used for fishing poles and fencing in India. Maybe available in smaller quantities elsewhere, I leave it to you to do the more extensive googling as I do not need any.

[asomotif]

Originally Posted by Will M

The lance butt appears different in profile than the British made ones that have a longer pointed tip. The ring around the butt might be made of two parts on yours?

The ring looks like it is made of one part. Maybe cleaning it would reveal somthing else, but in the present condition the ring looks like 1 part.
The butt as a whole is made of a tappered butt part with indeed a loose ring.