french sword of napoleons old guard ??

terry1956 · 29th March 2012, 06:15 PM

hi. I hope that someone out there can put some light on this sword, it was listed in a paris auction as a sword of napoleons old guard. the blade as had the eagle and imperial guard erased, replaced by " Honor and patrie". My understanding is that on the fall of napoleon soon after waterloo the old guard was removed from paris and disbanded. sorry i have only the two pictures of the sword as yet i don,t collect it until mid april. but what is your take on this item. michael

fernando · 29th March 2012, 07:34 PM

Hi Michael,
Why do you think the motto Honneur et Patrie replaced the Eagle and Imperial Garde engravings?
Perhaps the motto is a remnant (not a replacement) from the origin engraving, as it was the motto of the Legion d'Honneur, established by Napoleon as the French highest condecoration.
Your sword would indeed be a Sabre d'Honneur, with which Napoleon presented 145 officers of La Garde.
There would be three different models, to distinguish the rank of the officer presented.
Apparently this insignia was altered in 1814, with the removal of the eagle and, in the case of condecorations, the face of Napolen was replaced by that of Bourbon King Henry IV, whom could also be the guy on the cross hilt of your sword.
Hope this helps ... and expect it is reliable

terry1956 · 29th March 2012, 08:05 PM

hi, fernando, I don,t think this sword is a sabre de honneur, they are much nicer. the remains of the eagle can just be made out in the picture just before the start of Honor and patrie.have you any infor on the three models in use at teh time, michael

fernando · 29th March 2012, 08:39 PM

No, i just found this in the Web:
http://www.napoleon.org/fr/salle_lec...eur_Empire.asp
There was one model for Generals, one for heavy Cavalry and one for light Cavalry officers.
Certainly the model for Generals was much more elaborated than those for Cavalry officers; but you are probably right.
Just for perusal, here you find the list of those presented with Sabres of Honour:
http://www.napoleon-series.org/milit...ardarmes1.html

terry1956 · 29th March 2012, 10:56 PM

thanks fernando, I have seen some swords of honour for sale at auctions and if named go for lots of money, there was also the silver swords that got given out by napoleon for acts of valour, I think that a number when to the imperial guard but when the legion of honour medal came into being in 1804 the silver swords came to an end.
michael

fernando · 10th April 2012, 02:26 PM

Hi Michael,
I thought you might like to see this example... and the supporting text.

.

29th March 2012, 06:15 PM	#1
terry1956 Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: yeovil, somerset, uk Posts: 75	french sword of napoleons old guard ?? hi. I hope that someone out there can put some light on this sword, it was listed in a paris auction as a sword of napoleons old guard. the blade as had the eagle and imperial guard erased, replaced by " Honor and patrie". My understanding is that on the fall of napoleon soon after waterloo the old guard was removed from paris and disbanded. sorry i have only the two pictures of the sword as yet i don,t collect it until mid april. but what is your take on this item. michael Attached Images

29th March 2012, 08:05 PM	#3
terry1956 Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: yeovil, somerset, uk Posts: 75	thanks hi, fernando, I don,t think this sword is a sabre de honneur, they are much nicer. the remains of the eagle can just be made out in the picture just before the start of Honor and patrie.have you any infor on the three models in use at teh time, michael

29th March 2012, 10:56 PM	#5
terry1956 Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: yeovil, somerset, uk Posts: 75	thanks thanks fernando, I have seen some swords of honour for sale at auctions and if named go for lots of money, there was also the silver swords that got given out by napoleon for acts of valour, I think that a number when to the imperial guard but when the legion of honour medal came into being in 1804 the silver swords came to an end. michael

10th April 2012, 02:26 PM	#6
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hi Michael, I thought you might like to see this example... and the supporting text. . Attached Images

29th March 2012, 07:34 PM	#2
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hi Michael, Why do you think the motto Honneur et Patrie replaced the Eagle and Imperial Garde engravings? Perhaps the motto is a remnant (not a replacement) from the origin engraving, as it was the motto of the Legion d'Honneur, established by Napoleon as the French highest condecoration. Your sword would indeed be a Sabre d'Honneur, with which Napoleon presented 145 officers of La Garde. There would be three different models, to distinguish the rank of the officer presented. Apparently this insignia was altered in 1814, with the removal of the eagle and, in the case of condecorations, the face of Napolen was replaced by that of Bourbon King Henry IV, whom could also be the guy on the cross hilt of your sword. Hope this helps ... and expect it is reliable

29th March 2012, 08:39 PM	#4
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	No, i just found this in the Web: http://www.napoleon.org/fr/salle_lec...eur_Empire.asp There was one model for Generals, one for heavy Cavalry and one for light Cavalry officers. Certainly the model for Generals was much more elaborated than those for Cavalry officers; but you are probably right. Just for perusal, here you find the list of those presented with Sabres of Honour: http://www.napoleon-series.org/milit...ardarmes1.html