Museum Nusantara

[Dajak]

There is an nice exebithion about the kris in here about mystiek and much more a lot off pusaka s can be see here that still have the power in them.


http://www.museum.nl/museumnl/handle...B-C4C70D36988B

So if you are in the Netherlands visit this one

Ben

[David]

Thanks for the link Ben. I don't suppose there is an English translation of this page. is there.
This raises an interesting question for me. We often hear people saying that this keris or that still has some "power" in it, but really that is such a vague thing to say. What exactly do we mean when we say such a thing? Not only what did it mean to the original owner of the keris, but what does it mean to us who now collect them? Is not the "power" of an old pusaka keris based on the strong link of family ties and the energy of cultural belief placed into them over the generations? What does it mean when that chain is broken? What actual "power" can a pusaka keris hold for the collector, especially if he is from outside of the culture? Can this "power" be accessed, and if so, what can it actually do?

[rasdan]

Hi David,

I can see u r really interested in this energy stuff for a long time. U must had studied something regarding this and I'm sure you yourself can access the "power" if its there. I'll just summarise what i know about the energy. I dont know much and if you already know this, i am sorry.

The energy is generated by entity(s) living in the keris. An paranormal can contact them even if they are dormant. It can be in any form; tiger, snake, scorpion, bird, balls of fire and human being etc., depending to their preference. Each has their own use fighting, charm, business etc. And of course they have different level of capability. When these entities are contacted and if they aggree to be your servant, they will perform their duties for you as long as u stick to your end of the bargain which is you have to feed them in form of smoke, fragranced oil, flowers, pop-corns (im serious) and some weird stuff like chickens liver and some.. prefers blood. Some can lift stuff physically..some can just lift paper and some could lift bulldozers. Most of them cant perform physical tasks.

For a collector, if your keris has it, you can still communicate with them. But with risks of course. If they didnt like you, they can do a lot of damage. Some are stored to protect their family chain, but you can still bargain. You dont have to own a keris to befriended with this entities. A keris is better because the entitiy follows the new owner if you wish to get rid of them.

How? You'll have to ask a paranormal. I dont know the procedure and i wont learn as it is against my faith.

[Dajak]

Hi David it is for me difficult to explain it in an foreign language but it s like this not every keris has it but a few in the netherlands are big collection s
I had over 300 myself had very good and very bad experience with it the problem with it is that it can get control over your life and if you can t stand it it take s over the control over you and it s not easy to get out the power is that you might get some favor s but it have always you have to give in return and that if you do some black magic with it think the evil always get back to you I if you use it for black magic you might get the things you do to other people you not get away with it and the kris need some sacrifice from you

if you have skype and you wanna know more I can tell you true story s that can be verified by people and books

Send it to me in an private mail and the time you can be reached ( if you want)

Ben

[Henk]

I've been there in the X-mas holiday. It is a great exhibition. I really enjoyed it. Even my wife liked it, although she liked the shopping after the visit of the museum more.

[David]

Originally Posted by Dajak

if you have skype and you wanna know more I can tell you true story s that can be verified by people and books

I guess i don't have skype because i don't know what it is.
To be clear, i do not doubt the metaphysical aspects of the keris, it is what got me so interested to begin with. Metaphysics has been a study of mine much longer than the keris. I have learned over the years, however, to keep an open yet skeptical mind. Stories "verified" by people and books are still very subjective in nature. They do not display empirical fact. Events that seem very real to one person may in fact have alternative explanations. Stories are also embellished and exaggerated sometimes. It is just our human nature. This does not cause me to disbelieve, only to search further.
I remain even more skeptical of those who set themselves up as "paranormals" who are capable of sensing these powers within the keris when others cannot. If you can't feel and/or access this power yourself what possible good can it be to you? Within any culture with such a magickal/mystical world view as this the likelihood of chalatans taking advantage of hopeful people is magnified 100 times. How many of these "paranormals" will assess the "power" of your keris for free? Again, i don't say this because i doubt the existence of such power. It is just that there will always be individuals ready and willing to take advantage of such belief.
Ben, if you have stories i would encourage you to share them here. That was my purpose in raising these questions, to bring them into a community discussion. I see no reason to swap such stories in private emails.
Frankly, to me the reported powers of the keris seem a bit all over the board. I have a feeling that the original intention was something far more specific. In any discussion of the metaphysical there is bound to be superstition and fairytales thrown into the mix. Some stories i believe are merely legend, other's rooted more in fact. If indeed there are or were keris capable of lifting a bulldozer for instance one would have to wonder just how the Dutch managed to actually take control of the area with mere guns and cannons.
The way you describe this magickal relationship Ben it seems really hard to understand it within the context of a strictly Islamic society (albeit one that has kept and incorporated remnants of it animistic past). But how does making deals with enities within a keris for material favors sit with Allah and one's faith in Islam? As you say, it sounds like black magick to me. I don't think this was the original intent of the spiritual nature of the keris.

[rasdan]

Originally Posted by David

Some stories i believe are merely legend, other's rooted more in fact. If indeed there are or were keris capable of lifting a bulldozer for instance one would have to wonder just how the Dutch managed to actually take control of the area with mere guns and cannons.

Bulldozers story is true. But very rare and theres something about these creatures that it wont help you when you are dying like when a foreigner points a canon at you . Their objective is only to make trouble. Their service is just a disguise. When u got trouble and dies or gets the country colonised (anything bad) the objective is achieved. Thats why im not interested in them. Im not trying to get your attention nechesh, i know u want to know.