Aceh Sikin for coments

[fernando]

Using the search button i have learnt that this type of grip ( Hulu) is called Rumpung ( hope i'm right).
Entering RhysMichael's excelent work i figured out this sword style would be a Peudeueng Panjang. Somewhere i've read Panjang means large?
What i didn't yet find out is whether this specific style, namely the grip, is typical of a determined subethnic group ( Aceh , Gayo, Alas, etc.), or is generical to all.

However my main question goes for the way the grip fits to the bolster. Despite the quality of this piece being of a certain level, i don't find a reasonable explanation for the fact that the grip ( throat? ) diameter is clearly narrower than the bolster, not to mention the sort of crude gap at the junction. Also surprising is the lack of decoration "scales" on the horn material in that area. I first thaught that all this "irregularity" meant that some sort of decoration ring or crown has being there before and, for imaginable reasons, was later "harvested" from the handle.
However i have lately seen quite a few pictures of these swords and i don't find that the ones of this type, those with inlay on the blade, have additional fittings on the grip.
It could be that what i have here is a handle replacement, but i don't realy think this is the issue.
Could it be, however that, these handles are typicaly (un) finished this way ?
I know that some members in the Forum have great knowledge of these swords and have already handled several examples.
Could i please have some input on this subject ?
Obviously also general coments will be welcome.
Much obliged.
Fernando
PS
I have made a sketch on the handle extra picture, to support my poor english text .

[Dajak]

If there was an crown or ring on it you see it on the hilt .

If you take an look at the swapforum an rentjong is sold missing part off the crown as you can see it is carved in the hilt and different color where the missing piece was .

I never see an crown on an inlayed blade like this and like to see an picture of it if it exist .

The litlle darker color below the hilt is from rust .

Name off hilt hulu rumpung page 125

Ben

ps don t you have zonnevelds Book (an must for the weapon collector)

[asomotif]

Dear Fernando,

I also get the impression that a piece of gold ? has been harvested once

For comparrison 2 Sikins with gold inlay.
The first I still have, the second I sold last year much too cheap.

[kronckew]

here is a photo of a number of sikin (and a rencong) with additional metal fittings, looks like yours may have a bit missing after all. i note some of the hulu on the source pages other sikin do taper a bit abruptly towards the bolster as if fitted badly.



The source link

my modern plain one for comparison

[asomotif]

This picture is the old stock (or collection ) from Ben.

Therefore his claim that inlay and collar are/were not combined.

[Dajak]

You right Willem I like to see the ones that have the inlay like the first one
and have an golden crown like the rentjong .

It looks like they not exist .


Ben

[Dajak]

Originally Posted by asomotif

Dear Fernando,

I also get the impression that a piece of gold ? has been harvested once

For comparrison 2 Sikins with gold inlay.
The first I still have, the second I sold last year much too cheap.

Willem you should sure have keep the second one because the first one looks like they replace the Handle


Ben

[fernando]

Thank you all for your input, Gentlemen.
In view of what has been said (and unsaid) and also due to lack of sustainable evidence, i think i better give this dilemma the benefit of the doubt. Indeed the grip/bolster junction, in this example, is not the ideal match, but it seems as this is not a valid self speaker, for what matters. Although the thickness gap between the two parts is somehow outstanding, this appears not to be an uncommon irregularity, judging by other examples one can see out there.
Also i have yet not seen a sikim of this style (blade inlay) with grip (crown) ornaments.
Attached is the picture of one of similar kind, that i found at Oriental Arms arquives, in comparison with my example.

Fernando

[Battara]

What is the difference in status or significance between the gold inlay type and the "crown" type of ferrule?

[kai]

Hello Fernando,

Although the thickness gap between the two parts is somehow outstanding, this appears not to be an uncommon irregularity, judging by other examples one can see out there.
Also i have yet not seen a sikim of this style (blade inlay) with grip (crown) ornaments.
Attached is the picture of one of similar kind, that i found at Oriental Arms arquives, in comparison with my example.

Actually, I think that this piece from Artzi might be another example of an inlaid blade with (missing) golden crown: If one looks closely, there seems to be the "shadow" of a spiny crown visible where the hatching of the grip starts. It doesn't show the typical deep marks/impressions of the spikes (those Ben and me are referring to) though. However, even if this example doesn't help to prove the case, I believe it should be enough of an indication to keep an open mind on decorations of Aceh blades...

Regards,
Kai