Breech loading 1450-1550

Matchlock · 21st October 2008, 10:29 PM

From top:

- an extremely rare wrought iron chamber for a small breech loading falconet (Kammerschlange), ca. 1450, length 23 cm, bore ca. 3 cm; yet in my collection, but for sale as I do not collect cannons any longer

- two views of such breech loading cannons: the first in the Historisches Museum Berne, ca. 1460-70, the carriage an early 20th century reconstruction; the second a line drawing from the Maximilianische Zeugbücher, ca. 1500

- a beautiful breech loading matchlock harquebus, dated 1553, made by Peter Peck in Munich

Michael

Matchlock · 21st October 2008, 10:49 PM

I sold this a few weeks ago:

46 cm long, bore 4 cm, weight 54 kilograms (!) - remember it's just a powder chamber that was closed by a wooden plug. The bullet(s) were shoved in the barrel from the rear before the breech piece was put in and secured by wooden or iron wedges.

It originally belonged to a big breech-loading cannon like the ones found on the Mary Rose of Henry VIII that sank in 1545 - see b/w illustration.

Michael

Matchlock · 12th November 2008, 05:00 PM

In the Bayerisches Armeemuseum Ingolstadt.

Michael

Pukka Bundook · 20th November 2008, 02:39 PM

Michael,

Please forgive me digging up old posts, but we have had a friend from Scotland staying with us for six weeks, and as time was short, I appear to have missed a lot of interesting topics!

The harquebus by Peter Peck of Munchen must be the Very first bolt-action made! It is amazing, the quality of work, and the very clean action is identical to the modern bolt action. I have not seen anything quite like it for this date.
Gas leakage would have been minimised by such a long chamber, and I think it would be a very effective system.
Could not a number of such "cartridges" be carried, ready primed ?

Thank you for the images!!!!!

Richard.

Matchlock · 20th November 2008, 07:17 PM

Richard,

No one could be any happier than myself about your shedding new light on one of my older posts (I joined the forum only two months ago).

Actually, the bolt action breech loading system has been employed with wheel-locks at least from 1540.

I attach some images of a combined snap tinder lock and self spanning wheel-lock breech loading harquebus (the snap tinder holder and iron "cartridge" now missing), the barrel bearing the double falchion mark of Christoph Arnold, Augsburg, ca. 1540 (an almost identical piece in the collection of Schloss Grunewald near Berlin bears the same marks together with the date 1540), and a short wheel-lock breech loading harquebus or pistol by the same maker and of identical date. I got allowed to take the photos of the latter in the Imperial Vienna collection 20 years ago. Its exceptionally fine condition strikingly illustrates the original impact of contrasting colored surfaces in those mid 16th century pieces!

You are doubtlessly right in assuming that such a costly and refined system would only have made sense if used together with pre loaded and readily primed interchangeable iron "cartridges". Only in wheel-locks the pan was an integral part of the lock and had to be primed manually prior to each shot.

Interchangeable breech loading with cannon was in use since at least mid 15th century. It took some time to get applied to harquebuses, though.

We know of some very rare breech loading break down action flintlock guns of early to mid 18th century date whose sets of spare cartridges are still contained in a leather collar, each of them equipped with its own frizzen and pan - perfectly ready and primed!
I enclose some views of one rare sample of such a rifle, ca. 1700 but re-stocked in mid 18th century, together with its original cartridge collar containing 11 numbered and rifled (!!!) iron cartridges, with number 12 inserted in the breech. I was granted to take the pictures in the reserve collection of the Princes of Thurn & Taxis, Regensburg/Bavaria, 26 years ago.

In all probability, mid 16th century "cartridge" containers for breech loaders looked very much the same.

Great mind job, buddy - and thanks for inspiring me to post the following attachments!

Btw, how do you like my photo archive?

Michael

Matchlock · 20th November 2008, 07:22 PM

The extremely fine and perfectly preserved Vienna breech loading wheel-lock pistol, like the harquebus posted above made by Simon Arnold, Augsburg, ca. 1540.

21st October 2008, 10:29 PM	#1
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Breech loading 1450-1550 From top: - an extremely rare wrought iron chamber for a small breech loading falconet (Kammerschlange), ca. 1450, length 23 cm, bore ca. 3 cm; yet in my collection, but for sale as I do not collect cannons any longer - two views of such breech loading cannons: the first in the Historisches Museum Berne, ca. 1460-70, the carriage an early 20th century reconstruction; the second a line drawing from the Maximilianische Zeugbücher, ca. 1500 - a beautiful breech loading matchlock harquebus, dated 1553, made by Peter Peck in Munich Michael Attached Images

21st October 2008, 10:49 PM	#2
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	A huge breech chamber, ca. 1540 I sold this a few weeks ago: 46 cm long, bore 4 cm, weight 54 kilograms (!) - remember it's just a powder chamber that was closed by a wooden plug. The bullet(s) were shoved in the barrel from the rear before the breech piece was put in and secured by wooden or iron wedges. It originally belonged to a big breech-loading cannon like the ones found on the Mary Rose of Henry VIII that sank in 1545 - see b/w illustration. Michael Attached Images

12th November 2008, 05:00 PM	#3
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Breech loading pieces, mid 15th century In the Bayerisches Armeemuseum Ingolstadt. Michael Attached Images

20th November 2008, 07:17 PM	#5
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Iron "cartridges" for early breech loaders Richard, No one could be any happier than myself about your shedding new light on one of my older posts (I joined the forum only two months ago). Actually, the bolt action breech loading system has been employed with wheel-locks at least from 1540. I attach some images of a combined snap tinder lock and self spanning wheel-lock breech loading harquebus (the snap tinder holder and iron "cartridge" now missing), the barrel bearing the double falchion mark of Christoph Arnold, Augsburg, ca. 1540 (an almost identical piece in the collection of Schloss Grunewald near Berlin bears the same marks together with the date 1540), and a short wheel-lock breech loading harquebus or pistol by the same maker and of identical date. I got allowed to take the photos of the latter in the Imperial Vienna collection 20 years ago. Its exceptionally fine condition strikingly illustrates the original impact of contrasting colored surfaces in those mid 16th century pieces! You are doubtlessly right in assuming that such a costly and refined system would only have made sense if used together with pre loaded and readily primed interchangeable iron "cartridges". Only in wheel-locks the pan was an integral part of the lock and had to be primed manually prior to each shot. Interchangeable breech loading with cannon was in use since at least mid 15th century. It took some time to get applied to harquebuses, though. We know of some very rare breech loading break down action flintlock guns of early to mid 18th century date whose sets of spare cartridges are still contained in a leather collar, each of them equipped with its own frizzen and pan - perfectly ready and primed! I enclose some views of one rare sample of such a rifle, ca. 1700 but re-stocked in mid 18th century, together with its original cartridge collar containing 11 numbered and rifled (!!!) iron cartridges, with number 12 inserted in the breech. I was granted to take the pictures in the reserve collection of the Princes of Thurn & Taxis, Regensburg/Bavaria, 26 years ago. In all probability, mid 16th century "cartridge" containers for breech loaders looked very much the same. Great mind job, buddy - and thanks for inspiring me to post the following attachments! Btw, how do you like my photo archive? Michael Attached Images

20th November 2008, 07:22 PM	#6
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	The extremely fine and perfectly preserved Vienna breech loading wheel-lock pistol, like the harquebus posted above made by Simon Arnold, Augsburg, ca. 1540. Attached Images

20th November 2008, 02:39 PM	#4
Pukka Bundook Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 803	Michael, Please forgive me digging up old posts, but we have had a friend from Scotland staying with us for six weeks, and as time was short, I appear to have missed a lot of interesting topics! The harquebus by Peter Peck of Munchen must be the Very first bolt-action made! It is amazing, the quality of work, and the very clean action is identical to the modern bolt action. I have not seen anything quite like it for this date. Gas leakage would have been minimised by such a long chamber, and I think it would be a very effective system. Could not a number of such "cartridges" be carried, ready primed ? Thank you for the images!!!!! Richard.