Jezail Pistol ???

Norman McCormick · 26th February 2009, 07:38 PM

Hi Guys,
For sale locally described as a Jezail Pistol, is this on balance liable to be a tourist piece or not, there are other pieces in the photo for comparison of scale. Am going to see it tomorrow but just want some opinions on the possibilities. Ward if you're about?
Regards,
Norman.
P.S. Am not looking for opinions on value.

LPCA · 26th February 2009, 11:13 PM

Hi, Norman.
Never seen such a short jezaïl...the stock seems to be in proportion with the size of the barrel. The flintlock would talk more. It seems to be a rifle lock. A pity we cannot see it. They often are war spoils from HEIC or EEIC or VEIC with appropriate markings (heart or lion).... or a reproduction.
So, have a good glance at this lock.
Louis-Pierre

Norman McCormick · 26th February 2009, 11:33 PM

Hi Louis-Pierre,
Thanks for your reply, my first instinct from the photograph was 'repro wallhanger' but my knowledge does not extend very far in this area so I just wasn't sure.

This particular saleroom is generally pretty good at identifying and saying if something is repro or not but they don't always get it right. I will, as you suggest, take a good look at the lock that should reveal if it is 'right' or not. Maybe it's the Jezail equivalent of a 'sawn off shotgun' !!!!
My Regards,
Norman.

TVV · 26th February 2009, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norman McCormick

Maybe it's the Jezail equivalent of a 'sawn off shotgun'

That was my impression from the photo as well - a shortened rifle.
Regards,
Teodor

ward · 26th February 2009, 11:42 PM

There are smaller pieces made for children, but I can not commit without seeing a few more detailed pics. mainly from the lock side and the barrel end. It is a late piece either way 1880-1990. I know this is a huge range but I need some more detailed shots to give a better opinion

Norman McCormick · 26th February 2009, 11:53 PM

Hi,
Teodor after a longer look that was the impression I got. Ward I will take some photos tomorrow when I see the gun, hopefully they'll give a better idea of what it is. Is there any evidence of these types of weapon being modified for concealment or is this just fanciful.
My Regards,
Norman.

kahnjar1 · 27th February 2009, 05:59 AM

My two pennies worth says it would not have been made for concealment, as the decoration is too nice. The Arabs generally like to show off their decorated weapons.
Regards Stuart

LPCA · 27th February 2009, 09:36 AM

Bonjour,
Never really easy to judge a Jezaïl. The fancy way they use to adorn the stock let us think (after a cleaning) that we face a tourist model.... In fact, they are great craftmen, the John Galliano of firearms and they are genious to produce a musket with a patchwork of components. Most of the time, only the stock is really afghan. Barrels and stocks used to be imported from Persia, but remember they collect a vasr spoils of war after the 3 Anglo-afghan wars. For the moment, only the Jezaïl of Sind appears to me as a locally fully-made musquet.

Have a glance to a part of a study to come on my website in french (I am sorry, no one perfect).

http://blade.japet.com/12-asie.htm
http://blade.japet.com/B-afghan.htm
http://blade.japet.com/B-afghan1.htm
http://blade.japet.com/B-sind.htm

Don't hesitate to ask me details if you need it.
May i ask you your opinion on:

- the pattern of the barrel of Aghan1 - i guess an old one - maybe indian or persan???
- Ward, will you please see the arabic ou persian inscription on the Barrel of Afghan.

Thanks and see You.
Louis-Pierre

Norman McCormick · 27th February 2009, 06:00 PM

Hi,
'Jezail Pistol' complete rubbish I'm afraid. Many thanks to all who took the time to post their thoughts.
Regards,
Norman.

P.S. Louis-Pierre, nice muskets, are they yours?

LPCA · 27th February 2009, 10:55 PM

Norman, happy to have with other friends contributed to inform you before you have it in hands...
Yes, they are mine.
Louis-Pierre

26th February 2009, 07:38 PM	#1
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Jezail Pistol ??? Hi Guys, For sale locally described as a Jezail Pistol, is this on balance liable to be a tourist piece or not, there are other pieces in the photo for comparison of scale. Am going to see it tomorrow but just want some opinions on the possibilities. Ward if you're about? Regards, Norman. P.S. Am not looking for opinions on value. Attached Images Last edited by Norman McCormick; 26th February 2009 at 09:23 PM.

27th February 2009, 06:00 PM	#9
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Hi, 'Jezail Pistol' complete rubbish I'm afraid. Many thanks to all who took the time to post their thoughts. Regards, Norman. P.S. Louis-Pierre, nice muskets, are they yours? Last edited by Norman McCormick; 27th February 2009 at 06:25 PM.

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26th February 2009, 11:13 PM	#2
LPCA Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Toulouse - FRANCE Posts: 83	Hi, Norman. Never seen such a short jezaïl...the stock seems to be in proportion with the size of the barrel. The flintlock would talk more. It seems to be a rifle lock. A pity we cannot see it. They often are war spoils from HEIC or EEIC or VEIC with appropriate markings (heart or lion).... or a reproduction. So, have a good glance at this lock. Louis-Pierre

26th February 2009, 11:33 PM	#3
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Hi Louis-Pierre, Thanks for your reply, my first instinct from the photograph was 'repro wallhanger' but my knowledge does not extend very far in this area so I just wasn't sure. This particular saleroom is generally pretty good at identifying and saying if something is repro or not but they don't always get it right. I will, as you suggest, take a good look at the lock that should reveal if it is 'right' or not. Maybe it's the Jezail equivalent of a 'sawn off shotgun' !!!! My Regards, Norman.

26th February 2009, 11:42 PM	#5
ward Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 637	There are smaller pieces made for children, but I can not commit without seeing a few more detailed pics. mainly from the lock side and the barrel end. It is a late piece either way 1880-1990. I know this is a huge range but I need some more detailed shots to give a better opinion

26th February 2009, 11:53 PM	#6
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Hi, Teodor after a longer look that was the impression I got. Ward I will take some photos tomorrow when I see the gun, hopefully they'll give a better idea of what it is. Is there any evidence of these types of weapon being modified for concealment or is this just fanciful. My Regards, Norman.

27th February 2009, 05:59 AM	#7
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,739	My two pennies worth says it would not have been made for concealment, as the decoration is too nice. The Arabs generally like to show off their decorated weapons. Regards Stuart

27th February 2009, 09:36 AM	#8
LPCA Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Toulouse - FRANCE Posts: 83	Bonjour, Never really easy to judge a Jezaïl. The fancy way they use to adorn the stock let us think (after a cleaning) that we face a tourist model.... In fact, they are great craftmen, the John Galliano of firearms and they are genious to produce a musket with a patchwork of components. Most of the time, only the stock is really afghan. Barrels and stocks used to be imported from Persia, but remember they collect a vasr spoils of war after the 3 Anglo-afghan wars. For the moment, only the Jezaïl of Sind appears to me as a locally fully-made musquet. Have a glance to a part of a study to come on my website in french (I am sorry, no one perfect). http://blade.japet.com/12-asie.htm http://blade.japet.com/B-afghan.htm http://blade.japet.com/B-afghan1.htm http://blade.japet.com/B-sind.htm Don't hesitate to ask me details if you need it. May i ask you your opinion on: - the pattern of the barrel of Aghan1 - i guess an old one - maybe indian or persan??? - Ward, will you please see the arabic ou persian inscription on the Barrel of Afghan. Thanks and see You. Louis-Pierre

27th February 2009, 10:55 PM	#10
LPCA Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Toulouse - FRANCE Posts: 83	Norman, happy to have with other friends contributed to inform you before you have it in hands... Yes, they are mine. Louis-Pierre