Requesting ID on pamor, dhapur, classification

jagabuwana · 25th June 2025, 02:40 AM

Hello everyone. It's been awhile. Hope you're all keeping well.

Snatched this up for a bargain at a local auction. Javanese keris it seems, in a Bali sandangan.

May I please request an ID on the pamor? It looks kind like ganggeng kanyut to me but I'm not so sure.

Ditto dhapur - I checked the Surakarta pakem and could not find an equivalent, but I did not look to deeply.

As for classification, any info here would be welcome. Though I realise not every keris can be classified and even then can be difficult through just photos.

Rick · 25th June 2025, 03:48 AM

I can't classify it, but it looks like an aquatic plant; Hydrilla or water Thyme.

A. G. Maisey · 25th June 2025, 05:02 AM

Nice old keris Jaga. Any wrongko?

We are looking at a remnant pamor motif here, & what we are seeing is not the complete motif. We can see that the "leaves" of the motif are offset , so I doubt that we have one of the blarak motifs. We have no idea at all of what the outer edges of the motif looked like, but looking at the motif in the sorsoran, before it becomes distorted by forging, it might been mayang mekar, but I lean more towards one of the ron (leaf) motifs. As the motif moves towards the point it becomes stretched, and just looking at this blade section it seems to present as ganggeng kanyut or any one of several other possibilities. In any case, in an older blade such as this, it must be recognised as skilled work.

Identification of the dhapur also poses problems, & for the same reason that the pamor motif is not easy to read:- erosion. However, it is a 9 luk blade, it had a kembang kacang & not much else, so I think I'd probably elect sempana.

If we wish to try to fit it to a tangguh classification, we need to base that on what remains to be seen, & what that remnant indicates. The kembang kacang is only a stub, this indicates that when the blade was made it was made with a rather thin & whispy kembang kacang, the point of the blade after the last luk is long, very slightly curved gonjo, no visible ada-ada, no kruwingen that I can see, shallow blumbangan, skilled work in the pamor motif. Taking all these indicators & eliminating the ineligible candidates, I feel inclined to back Madura Sepuh, ie, Old Madura.

In the hand, I could well change my opinion.

25th June 2025, 02:40 AM	#1
jagabuwana Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 291	Requesting ID on pamor, dhapur, classification Hello everyone. It's been awhile. Hope you're all keeping well. Snatched this up for a bargain at a local auction. Javanese keris it seems, in a Bali sandangan. May I please request an ID on the pamor? It looks kind like ganggeng kanyut to me but I'm not so sure. Ditto dhapur - I checked the Surakarta pakem and could not find an equivalent, but I did not look to deeply. As for classification, any info here would be welcome. Though I realise not every keris can be classified and even then can be difficult through just photos. Attached Images

25th June 2025, 03:48 AM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,340	I can't classify it, but it looks like an aquatic plant; Hydrilla or water Thyme.

25th June 2025, 05:02 AM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,020	Nice old keris Jaga. Any wrongko? We are looking at a remnant pamor motif here, & what we are seeing is not the complete motif. We can see that the "leaves" of the motif are offset , so I doubt that we have one of the blarak motifs. We have no idea at all of what the outer edges of the motif looked like, but looking at the motif in the sorsoran, before it becomes distorted by forging, it might been mayang mekar, but I lean more towards one of the ron (leaf) motifs. As the motif moves towards the point it becomes stretched, and just looking at this blade section it seems to present as ganggeng kanyut or any one of several other possibilities. In any case, in an older blade such as this, it must be recognised as skilled work. Identification of the dhapur also poses problems, & for the same reason that the pamor motif is not easy to read:- erosion. However, it is a 9 luk blade, it had a kembang kacang & not much else, so I think I'd probably elect sempana. If we wish to try to fit it to a tangguh classification, we need to base that on what remains to be seen, & what that remnant indicates. The kembang kacang is only a stub, this indicates that when the blade was made it was made with a rather thin & whispy kembang kacang, the point of the blade after the last luk is long, very slightly curved gonjo, no visible ada-ada, no kruwingen that I can see, shallow blumbangan, skilled work in the pamor motif. Taking all these indicators & eliminating the ineligible candidates, I feel inclined to back Madura Sepuh, ie, Old Madura. In the hand, I could well change my opinion.