[kai]

Originally Posted by rasdan

Anyway, im not sure how to really tell if its hardened or not, but judging from the steel edge color, i think it is.

Rasdan, do you know how the blade was treated/etched?

For the age, well.. i sure think its an old piece, not because it is mine but because of the condition of the tang.

I also think this blade is antique (e. g. there's some wear at the gangya's file work and considerable corrosion at the tip possibly from repeated etchings by a Malay owner). I don't see a reason to place it earlier than 2nd half of 19th c though.

(Unfortunately i did'nt get that Cato's book on eBay recently..

Go for one of the next copies...

Is it possibble that the keris is introduced by the Bugis to Philiphines?

The Moro and Bugis seemed to have had close ties, even beyond those given by their roles as dominant sea traders. But there were also close with several sultanates on Borneo. And there's still the possibility that the Moro ancestors brought keris with them when colonizing the archipelago.

I come across this website sometime ago and noticed that the sword used in the installation ceremony in the Gowa kingdom in South Sulawesi is a Sundang.

AFAIK, a Sundang doesn't necessarily refer to a Keris Sundang aka Kris but could be some other kind of (straight) sword. This also limits the interpretation of Woodwards account if there is no other supporting evidence. Is there an indigenous word for Keris Sundang in Buginese/Makassarese?

This makes me think, the bugis priced sundang's quite highly if it is used in the installation ceremony, not just merely a weapon. A weapon appreciated like that most probably originated from their own culture.

Quite a few royal heirlooms seem to have originated from outside the respective kingdoms if I recall correctly.

Perhaps it is the Bugis that introduced the sundang to Philiphines. Like Leaf said, they dispersed throughout the archipelago in late 17th C and surely brought their weapon with them.

This might be one of the factors for its distribution over the Riau region and other northern Malay areas. However, trade (which demonstrably included blades) might be a more pervasive (and much older) power in dispersing weapons of status. So, any provenanced, old non-Moro pieces available for public view?

Is it possibble that the Moro adopted the bugis sundang as their weapon in the 18thC?

IIRC, Mabagani thinks that the evolution of the Kris in Moroland predates the Bugis diaspora. Could you please elaborate?

There are examples of sundangs owned by the sultan of Perak and Terengganu which has a high Moro taste. The pictures are attached below.

Thanks, Rasdan! Is there additional info which would allow to date these pieces better than by reign period (most conservative assumption)?

Regards,
Kai