Takouba with single edged European blade
 

Just won the auction for this but it won't arrive for awhile. The blade supposedly says "Zacona Toscania". Zacona is a town in Tuscany, I presume that's where it was made. Does that town have a history of making swords?

Pity about the blade damage from rust, but otherwise a very nice and interesting takouba. Iain has similar Italian backsword blade mounted ones and I am sure he will chime in.

Teodor

An intriguing one! I'll hold off on detailed comments until I can see better images, but this has some interesting features like the brass at the base of the blade.

A pity about the condition of the blade, somewhat relic condition, but I still see a lot of appeal to the piece. :) I think you will find that the blade has been modified to be two edged.

I'll be interested to see details when you have it in hand. I am jealous that I didn't see it first!

Thanks! I was a little surprised you didn't snap it up, I figured it was too ratty for your collection. At least the "interesting" part of the blade is intact.

I simply didn't see it! :) needless to say if you tire of it.... :)

Now this is very interesting, especially as it is well established that the single edge blade is rather an anomaly among North African swords, as the broadsword is obviously favored. However, we know that with the brisk trade in blades through various entrepots there were occasions where these became mingled in the volume in whatever small degree.

We know that many blades, despite the more dominant input from Solingen, actually likely came from Italian sources which confluenced with the other trade networks inbound on occasion.

I would suspect this to be possibly a schiavona blade and of latter quarter 18th c. I will here go out on a limb with the inscription on the blade,
'ZACONA TOSCIANA'.
Clearly the Tosciana refers to Tuscany, but I would offer the speculation that the 'zacona' may relate to the Croatian/Slovenian word 'zakona' which loosely refers to 'law'.
We know that in Venice, the famed bodyguards of the Doge consisted largely of Dalmatian (Croatian) forces, and that the schiavona (indeed termed for this nationality) was quite well known in their use.
Perhaps this inscription might relate to some force or unit in Tuscany with some legal or enforcement capacity?

Whatever the case, this blade's terrible condition may be testament to its having been in this hilt for a very long time, thus, one of the much sought after early takouba with European blade. I would rely here on Iain's view on the character and likely age of the hilt.

My question would be otherwise, why would someone mount a virtual relic condition blade in a takouba? The tribesmen in these regions take great pride in their takouba, and would deem such a sword very poorly.

Another possible scenario is that some African merchant mounted a rusty old blade in a new hilt purely to sell to tourists, but the hilt seems just as corroded as the blade. Seems they've been togeather since before all the damage happened. Here's two more pictures of the hilt from the auction.

That is of course always possible, but that is a thing collectors have pretty much always contended with . As far as I have known however, these types would avoid using what is clearly regarded a rather pitiful blade as its marketability would be compromised.
As I mentioned, the hilt seems quite old as well, and Iain would have the final say on that as he knows these swords better than anyone .

The hilt is old, although not the oldest style I think we can identify. I think it has been with the blade since it was first mounted.

It is very hard to put a date to the hilt styles other than old, older, oldest type classification.

You have what I tend to think of as the second oldest style. The pommel is large but more of a lozenge shape than rounded. A medial ridge is defined. The guard is not boxy, but rather a wing shape, swelling where it meets the grip. The grip tube is round, not multi faceted.

Zacona I think will refer to the town, the phrase would be odd in Serbian or Croatian and in any case would require a K not a C. The blade is of a type that was widely exported including the well known firangi swords of India.I own one similar, see attached. I think the blade can be older than the 18th century, but I am not the best for dating this blade style. Better images will help when it arrives. :)

I am including images of what I would consider to be older hilt styles as well, hopefully what I am describing is visible from these images. In any case I think the blade and hilt are an authentic and original marriage and the sword is an excellent example of a hilt that has been with the blade for a very long time.

Congratulation, a fine sword.

I also saw it, but i bought a Piso Gading (which was not really cheap) one day before the end of this auction.

I think, it is an early Renaissance blade and one possibility could be, that this blade was found in a warrior tomb and was combined with a takouba hilt.

I wonder what can cause such massive nicks? Was he a guy like Bud Spencer?

It would be very nice, if you make a new thread after the blade is arrived.


Roland

Those extensive and quite regular indentations to the blade on both sides seem very odd...

I kind of doubt if they were caused only by rust.

If it's from rust I wonder if the pattern is due to the way the blade was forged? Or did somebody beat on the blade? You'd think that level of abuse would have snapped the blade.

These blades were widely exported, including to North Africa and then into the Sahel region. So not unusual at all really to see early blades in takouba mounts. If you look at the ones I posted you'll see even 14th and 15th century blades. ;)

A combination I think. I have seen other takouba blades with abuse to the edge that looks more than just coincidental...

When you say "exported", do you mean that they were made for export, or that they were used in Europe and then exported after their were no longer useful? If they were made for export it seems odd to put "Zacona Toscania" on the blade as nobody would be able to read it wherever it ended up. A symbol like a moon or lion or whatever would make it more identifiable I'd think.

By exported I mean they were made in Europe, some were mounted in Europe, some were exported as bare blades.

As an example one of the swords I posted above next to a schiavonesca. The blades are marked the same, the form is the same, one spent its life in Europe, the other blade quite a ways away.

With a little time this summer I'll hopefully finish a longish article on this topic. There are interesting records in terms of shipments from Italy to Ottoman and Mamluk areas including blades and you find European blades being mounted in Mamluk mounts as well.

Note: for clarity the schiavonesca and the mamluk sword in the comparison images are not mine, but sourced from past auctions and used here simply to illustrate elements of the takouba form.

In terms of your blade and the examples I have given we are looking at earlier blades than the stereotypical patterns of the 18th and 19th century marked with elements like the ubiquitous half moons, made specifically for export long after those styles had past their popularity in Europe.

Did you get the sword yet blue lander? :) Interested to seem more pictures.

I emailed the guy on sunday, he said he was going to send it out on Tuesday (yesterday). I paid him awhile ago, hopefully he isn't pulling shenanigans...

this takouba just ended on epray. single edged, desc. 1930-ish.
24in. blade 7g8 grams.

i went to bid but my browser messed up, so it is not coming home to me. :(

I noticed it as well, an interesting little piece. Relatively modern with a blade which appears to be sourced from sheet steel. But the dimensions I find rather attractive, almost machete like.

the blade did appear to be distal tapered in one photo.

Can be ground to be more narrow at the tip as it wouldn't surprise me if it was double edged at the tip.

ah, well, hope it went to a good home.

So this thing still hasn't arrived. I contacted the seller and he sent me the shipping number and a picture of the shipping label (to prove he wrote the right address ). When I looked the number up at colissimo it said it had made it to the US but couldn't be delivered and was being returned. The address he wrote was correct, I have no idea why it wasn't delivered. Any advice on how to fix this?

Colissimo is delivered by USPS usually I believe. Did you contact them to see what the explanation was?

I tried to contact Colissimo via email but they never responded. I'll try to contact USPS now.

Yep, best to contact the carrier stateside, did you try the tracking number in the USPS site?

Yeah, I tried entering the tracking on the usps site but it doesn't have any records. I contacted usps and they basically said they have no record of the package and no idea where it is. I'm asking the seller to contact colissimo but I'm not sure if he will...

Hi
I'm really sorry for you.
I know the site where you got your sword.
There are a lot of cheaters.
The guy should provide you the original tracking number.
Remember also the customs, maybe your stuff is blocked somewhere...

Good luck
Kubur

Well, it took longer than I expected but it finally arrived! I'll take better pictures tomorrow but I've attached a photo of the only writing I see on the blade. I don't see Toscania anywhere, just the below word. If you look at it upside down (with the edge facing upward) it sort of looks like it says ZANCONA but with the N's backwards.

glad you finally got it. interesting sword. i have a kaskara coming from france to the UK, shipped 5 days ago via colissimo. tracking says it' in switzerland.hope i do better with it's delivery.

here's a cyrillic alphabet from bulgaria - note the nackwards Ns are western Is

the 'Z' apears to be an earlier form of the modern cyrillic 'З', ='Ze'. not sure what that last letter would be. could be an early version of whatever. i'm not versed in ancient non western alphabets, of which there are a zillion.

i flipped the sword to make it easier to see

Hopefully someone can make heads or tails of it.

I can't find my good camera but here are two more pictures I took from my phone.

Assuming it is Cyrillic, and the backwards N's are I's and the C's are S's, maybe it says Zmissia or Zaissia? That second character could be an A, an M, or maybe a Yus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yus

Markings on a Takouba-mounted European Backsword
 

Hi,

I posted this on the ethnographic side, but as the blade appears to be European I've started a thread on this end.

The blade only has two markings on it. One is the writing, apparently in cyrillic or a related alphabet. The other is two clusters of three dots. There was probably something in between the dots, but corrosion removed it.

Any thoughts on what the blade says or where it came from?

Good call to cross post this here Blue Lander! I honestly don't think a lot of the guys on the Ethnographic side read or post over here as they do not see the connection between these fields. The very reason we did start this forum is because of the profound connections between European weapons/blades and ethnographic.
Ironically, one obvious reason for Briggs' outstanding work on European blade markings (JAAS, 1965) is because of their presence in Saharan takouba.

First inclinations on this blade is probably Italian, 18th century schiavona blade, in any case certainly European and of that vintage. This is a most interesting marriage of backsword blade to takouba, as obviously the standard was broadsword blades. However, many takouba were mounted in later incarnations with very old blades, which sometimes were military backswords etc.
I have seen 19th century blades even by Mole in some, which is uncommon to see English blades in takouba.

It seems also that native artisans have sometimes tried to duplicate European lettering in blades acquired, one with awkwardly applied letters seemed to attempt approximating ANDREA (Ferrara) but it is hard to tell as the 'A's are all really discernible.
This inscription seems to have a '2' then some letters which could be 'A's (?) and the backwards 'N's are temptingly like Cyrillic letter. However that seems wildly out of context.

It seems I have seen a mix of numeral and disconnected letters on a blade in Arabian context seemingly replicating European marks, and numbers of these Italian blades may have entered North African trade routes during their colonial activities in Sudan and Ethiopia end of 19th into pre WWII.

I hope someone out there can either recognize this or place a more tangible explanation beyond these speculations :)

I note the appearance in this line of capitals of two Majescule A which may be compared with The Odd Sword ,,,marks... http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=sword
:shrug:

As far as I could deduce the letters were A 5 I IJ IJ A with two Majescule A one at each end of the string of letters.

Jim there appear to be two A in Majescule gothic style..with a few letters between them and an unusual 2 at the front. This coincides roughly with the sword letters format at Odd Sword which makes me think they could be from the same region/related.

I have to say that an awful lot of stuff has been left somewhat stranded on the other forum including very important posts from members ...I don't disagree with posting on European ...quite the reverse... but would it not be better having the whole thread please?

An unsupported theory would be that, there is no cyrillic involved here. The mirror atitude of the N could just be the smith's fantasy ... or illiteracy.
Reading the lettering straight forward, we would have ANCONA which is the name, for one, of a city and province in center Italy, somehow related with Roman era history, ancient weapon archeology and the like.
Would there be swordmaking over there during the age of the blade in discussion ?
... Notwithstanding this is a silly approach :o .

Silly?
Silly is the editorial page on artwork now reaching classic proportion on the other forum!
There are a number of approaches to analysis of markings, and while your observation using Occams Razor is quite viable, sometimes things are not what they seem.

re: my earlier worry about colissimo. my short takouba sword shipped this last friday p.m. from the paris area, went to switzerland. got a note from the service delivering it last night that they'd deliver sometime today. here bright and early just before 8a.m. so it took about4+ days. colissimo shows it as being at the local delivery co.'s warehouse. guess they've not got the word yet. ;)

This is the only other marking on the blade. Two triangles of three dots. If there was anything written between them it was already eaten by corrosion. They're right after the ricasso and right before the writing.