What is this?

Yannis · 28th February 2005, 10:41 AM

What is this?????

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6511250837

It looks european, neoclassic, (19th century?). Cast bronze hilt and scabbard. The blade looks very good. Why the back side is like this?

tom hyle · 28th February 2005, 11:32 AM

It's a nice looking blade, with a not very practical looking mounting.
No direct view from the end, but it looks like there might be a peined tang end. The flat back might go against a wall, but it seems to have no hanging device. It might go on a desk, for a letter opener. The strange thing about the flat back is that the ball at the tip seems to "rise" above its surface, which would make it hard to lay it flat against a surface.

wolviex · 28th February 2005, 03:03 PM

Yes, it seems to be 19th century dagger. In my museum is something similiar - the knife with hilt and scabbard cast of bronze (if I do remember well), but made much better - where the hilt is made with a personification of Otello and his lover. The blade looks good, but it isn't older. I can't remember well, but I think the mentioned knife from my museum has similiar one, trying to imitate 17th century blade.

Conogre · 28th February 2005, 05:08 PM

The shape and markings on the blade as well as the overall shape of the entire knife is suggestive of a Zanzibar sword.
The flat, plain back is also in keeping with such pieces where only the front is patterned.
I'd be tempted to say a paper knife were it not for the blade, which makes me think that it may well be an elaborate dagger in the style of the Zanzibar swords and made to be carried in a frog.
No matter how you look at it, it's an interesting and unusual piece.
Mike

ingelred · 28th February 2005, 05:51 PM

This dagger reminds me of a late 16th/ early 17th century Landsknecht dagger. I have seen these on several pictures in my literature. The blade itself looks somewhat like a blade from a left hand dagger of this period but of much worse quality. I have watched this itam at ebay but since I had my doubts especially when looking at the blade I refused to bid.

ingelred · 28th February 2005, 05:51 PM

This dagger reminds me of a late 16th/ early 17th century German or Swiss Landsknecht dagger. I have seen these on several pictures in my literature. The blade itself looks somewhat like a blade from a left hand dagger of this period but of much worse quality. I have watched this itam at ebay but since I had my doubts especially when looking at the blade I refused to bid.

Rick · 28th February 2005, 11:24 PM

Anyone notice the winner's ebay ID .

wolviex · 28th February 2005, 11:36 PM

I looked at this dagger once more, and it assure me it is 19th century dagger and to be honest, this one isn't something special to me. One side is flat, just like someone was to lazy to made a full form, or it was made just for hanging on the wall. 17th century blades of this type where often openworked, this one is just "pointed" only to mark similarity. And details (take care look at busts on the sheath!) should be more precise to call it very good dagger, in my opinion.
Regards!

ingelred · 1st March 2005, 10:21 AM

wolviex,

that is what I meant. At a first glance it looks like a 17th century Lanzknecht dagger but at a closer look concerníng its quality it seems to be a copy of low quality made in the 19th century during the historism period.

Andrew · 1st March 2005, 05:39 PM

Does this remind anyone else of the "carriage" knife we discussed some time ago? My recollection of that knife was that it was designed to be mounted on the interior of a coach or carriage, and intended to blend into the decor. It would serve as an emergency weapon.

I couldn't find the old thread.

Ian · 1st March 2005, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Anyone notice the winner's ebay ID .

Yes I did. Anyone we know?

Rick · 1st March 2005, 08:46 PM

No one I know .
I thought it was kind of humorous .

Tim Simmons · 1st March 2005, 09:14 PM

It looks like a rather romantic reproduction renaissance "main gauche"why it is flat on one side who knows.I suppose someone somewhere will like it,money was spent when it was originally made.Tim

BSMStar · 8th March 2005, 03:33 AM

Is it just me... or does the blade remind you of a key??? Did it have a dual purpose?

wolviex · 8th March 2005, 06:32 PM

Yes - it's a key to a great Templar's treasure... or to the Masonic one... I can't remember well

. Only the price - 260$ - is quite low for a such attraction

To be serious, there is no way it have any dual purpose. For me it's still imitation of very popular pattern used in 17th cent. daggers. Below you can see similiar one on pics from my museum - made in Italy at the beginning of the 17th cent., with openworked holes. Beautiful work which this one from ebay trying only to imitate by this points on the blade.

But if you want to search a creeping story in it, there is one, I heard or read somewhere, even don't rember where: in the openworked holes, there used to be a poison intended for a treacherous lovers. After the hit with a dagger the poison had to slowly kill ungrateful one....

Regards

28th February 2005, 10:41 AM	#1
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	What is this? What is this????? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6511250837 It looks european, neoclassic, (19th century?). Cast bronze hilt and scabbard. The blade looks very good. Why the back side is like this?

8th March 2005, 06:32 PM	#15
wolviex Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Krakow Posts: 418	Treasures and poisons Yes - it's a key to a great Templar's treasure... or to the Masonic one... I can't remember well . Only the price - 260$ - is quite low for a such attraction To be serious, there is no way it have any dual purpose. For me it's still imitation of very popular pattern used in 17th cent. daggers. Below you can see similiar one on pics from my museum - made in Italy at the beginning of the 17th cent., with openworked holes. Beautiful work which this one from ebay trying only to imitate by this points on the blade. But if you want to search a creeping story in it, there is one, I heard or read somewhere, even don't rember where: in the openworked holes, there used to be a poison intended for a treacherous lovers. After the hit with a dagger the poison had to slowly kill ungrateful one.... Regards Attached Images

28th February 2005, 11:32 AM	#2
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	It's a nice looking blade, with a not very practical looking mounting. No direct view from the end, but it looks like there might be a peined tang end. The flat back might go against a wall, but it seems to have no hanging device. It might go on a desk, for a letter opener. The strange thing about the flat back is that the ball at the tip seems to "rise" above its surface, which would make it hard to lay it flat against a surface.

28th February 2005, 03:03 PM	#3
wolviex Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Krakow Posts: 418	Yes, it seems to be 19th century dagger. In my museum is something similiar - the knife with hilt and scabbard cast of bronze (if I do remember well), but made much better - where the hilt is made with a personification of Otello and his lover. The blade looks good, but it isn't older. I can't remember well, but I think the mentioned knife from my museum has similiar one, trying to imitate 17th century blade.

28th February 2005, 05:08 PM	#4
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	The shape and markings on the blade as well as the overall shape of the entire knife is suggestive of a Zanzibar sword. The flat, plain back is also in keeping with such pieces where only the front is patterned. I'd be tempted to say a paper knife were it not for the blade, which makes me think that it may well be an elaborate dagger in the style of the Zanzibar swords and made to be carried in a frog. No matter how you look at it, it's an interesting and unusual piece. Mike

28th February 2005, 05:51 PM	#5
ingelred Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Moenchengladbach, Germany Posts: 62	This dagger reminds me of a late 16th/ early 17th century Landsknecht dagger. I have seen these on several pictures in my literature. The blade itself looks somewhat like a blade from a left hand dagger of this period but of much worse quality. I have watched this itam at ebay but since I had my doubts especially when looking at the blade I refused to bid.

28th February 2005, 11:24 PM	#7
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Anyone notice the winner's ebay ID .

28th February 2005, 11:36 PM	#8
wolviex Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Krakow Posts: 418	I looked at this dagger once more, and it assure me it is 19th century dagger and to be honest, this one isn't something special to me. One side is flat, just like someone was to lazy to made a full form, or it was made just for hanging on the wall. 17th century blades of this type where often openworked, this one is just "pointed" only to mark similarity. And details (take care look at busts on the sheath!) should be more precise to call it very good dagger, in my opinion. Regards!

1st March 2005, 10:21 AM	#9
ingelred Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Moenchengladbach, Germany Posts: 62	wolviex, that is what I meant. At a first glance it looks like a 17th century Lanzknecht dagger but at a closer look concerníng its quality it seems to be a copy of low quality made in the 19th century during the historism period.

1st March 2005, 05:39 PM	#10
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	Does this remind anyone else of the "carriage" knife we discussed some time ago? My recollection of that knife was that it was designed to be mounted on the interior of a coach or carriage, and intended to blend into the decor. It would serve as an emergency weapon. I couldn't find the old thread.

1st March 2005, 08:46 PM	#12
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	No one I know . I thought it was kind of humorous .

1st March 2005, 09:14 PM	#13
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	It looks like a rather romantic reproduction renaissance "main gauche"why it is flat on one side who knows.I suppose someone somewhere will like it,money was spent when it was originally made.Tim

8th March 2005, 03:33 AM	#14
BSMStar Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kansas City, MO USA Posts: 312	Is it just me... or does the blade remind you of a key??? Did it have a dual purpose?