Giant British 1788 Light Cavalry Sabre

Bryce · 18th July 2024, 10:16 PM

G'day Guys,

Another interesting sword joined my collection recently. It is a British 1788 pattern, light cavalry officer's sabre, but there is nothing "light" about it. It is a beast of a sword and perhaps the biggest single handed British service sword I have ever seen. The blade is 4.8cm wide at the ricasso and 94cm long. It is signed by the maker John Knubley and can be dated to 1792-5. It must have been custom made for a guy who would have been considered a "giant" for the time. The other interesting feature is the "attack hilt", which has an additional two bars which can be folded out to provide better hand protection. Here it is next to a regulation 1796 pattern light cavalry troopers' sabre for comparison.

Cheers,

Bryce

Radboud · 18th July 2024, 11:41 PM

Fantastic sword Bryce, these 1788 officer swords with the rotating guards (I refuse to use 'Attack hilt'

) are really interesting swords and one I'd love to have an example of.

Do you have any photos of the guard mechanism?

Bryce · 19th July 2024, 01:44 AM

G'day Bas,
Unfortunately the attack hilt mechanism seems to be missing the part which keeps the bars open. I need to look at other examples to find out what is missing.
Cheers,
Bryce

awdaniec666 · 3rd August 2024, 02:17 PM

It doesn´t look like a British pattern 1788 LC to me. A lot of regions used that "Stirrup hilt" and foldable guards. And the point of patterns is the similarity between individual specimen which I cannot see here in comparison to the "classic 1788".

Bryce · 4th August 2024, 05:53 AM

G'day Awdaniec666,
There is a lot of variation between examples of British 1788 light cavalry swords, particularly between different makers. My sword is a custom made sword for an officer, rather than a regulation sword for a trooper. The blade and grip are both much larger than regulation and the regulations also didn't include a folding "attack hilt". There is no doubt that it is British made rather than continental and it can be positively dated to 1792-5, but I agree that it is not a "typical" 1788.
Cheers,
Bryce

Jim McDougall · 4th August 2024, 03:28 PM

Interesting discussion on these late 18th century British cavalry sabers, and MOST interesting example being of such notably large size.
I am wondering on the folding knuckle guard feature, and why the term 'attack hilt' is used (as noted). By its design it is of course a 'guard' for the hand.

I am also wondering if this folding type feature was taken from a French innovation (I think I saw this mentioned in Dellar) of the period.
While it seems the so called M1788 sabers followed a pretty standard hilt pattern, as seen in the sword exercises manual of the 1790s illustrations, there were it seems some nuances in the hilts.

One thing I noticed, which may be moot, is that James Wooley hilts seemed to follow more of a French character in the pommel has a domed effect and the langets are of elliptical shape. With Thomas Gill, his hilts were distinctly Germanic with squared elongated langets and the flat top pommel cap.

Naturally in the pre regulation cavalry hilt situation of the time, there would be variations by makers producing hilts, it would seem more prevalent with officers swords as these were essentially privately commissioned. In my view,it seems even the M1796 light cavalry patterns there was a degree of variation. I recall in my early days of collecting trying to find variant patterns of 1796 hilts. A friend in Denmark focused on this same topic wrote an article on this (I cant find it as yet, auughh!) showing variant hilts.

18th July 2024, 10:16 PM	#1
Bryce Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: North Queensland, Australia Posts: 186	Giant British 1788 Light Cavalry Sabre G'day Guys, Another interesting sword joined my collection recently. It is a British 1788 pattern, light cavalry officer's sabre, but there is nothing "light" about it. It is a beast of a sword and perhaps the biggest single handed British service sword I have ever seen. The blade is 4.8cm wide at the ricasso and 94cm long. It is signed by the maker John Knubley and can be dated to 1792-5. It must have been custom made for a guy who would have been considered a "giant" for the time. The other interesting feature is the "attack hilt", which has an additional two bars which can be folded out to provide better hand protection. Here it is next to a regulation 1796 pattern light cavalry troopers' sabre for comparison. Cheers, Bryce Attached Images

3rd August 2024, 02:17 PM	#4
awdaniec666 Member Join Date: May 2021 Location: Central Europe Posts: 167	It doesn´t look like a British pattern 1788 LC to me. A lot of regions used that "Stirrup hilt" and foldable guards. And the point of patterns is the similarity between individual specimen which I cannot see here in comparison to the "classic 1788". Attached Images

4th August 2024, 05:53 AM	#5
Bryce Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: North Queensland, Australia Posts: 186	G'day Awdaniec666, There is a lot of variation between examples of British 1788 light cavalry swords, particularly between different makers. My sword is a custom made sword for an officer, rather than a regulation sword for a trooper. The blade and grip are both much larger than regulation and the regulations also didn't include a folding "attack hilt". There is no doubt that it is British made rather than continental and it can be positively dated to 1792-5, but I agree that it is not a "typical" 1788. Cheers, Bryce Attached Images

18th July 2024, 11:41 PM	#2
Radboud Member Join Date: Sep 2021 Location: New Zealand Posts: 261	Fantastic sword Bryce, these 1788 officer swords with the rotating guards (I refuse to use 'Attack hilt' ) are really interesting swords and one I'd love to have an example of. Do you have any photos of the guard mechanism?

19th July 2024, 01:44 AM	#3
Bryce Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: North Queensland, Australia Posts: 186	G'day Bas, Unfortunately the attack hilt mechanism seems to be missing the part which keeps the bars open. I need to look at other examples to find out what is missing. Cheers, Bryce

4th August 2024, 03:28 PM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,946	Interesting discussion on these late 18th century British cavalry sabers, and MOST interesting example being of such notably large size. I am wondering on the folding knuckle guard feature, and why the term 'attack hilt' is used (as noted). By its design it is of course a 'guard' for the hand. I am also wondering if this folding type feature was taken from a French innovation (I think I saw this mentioned in Dellar) of the period. While it seems the so called M1788 sabers followed a pretty standard hilt pattern, as seen in the sword exercises manual of the 1790s illustrations, there were it seems some nuances in the hilts. One thing I noticed, which may be moot, is that James Wooley hilts seemed to follow more of a French character in the pommel has a domed effect and the langets are of elliptical shape. With Thomas Gill, his hilts were distinctly Germanic with squared elongated langets and the flat top pommel cap. Naturally in the pre regulation cavalry hilt situation of the time, there would be variations by makers producing hilts, it would seem more prevalent with officers swords as these were essentially privately commissioned. In my view,it seems even the M1796 light cavalry patterns there was a degree of variation. I recall in my early days of collecting trying to find variant patterns of 1796 hilts. A friend in Denmark focused on this same topic wrote an article on this (I cant find it as yet, auughh!) showing variant hilts.