Medieval style dagger repro but how old ??

[Marius66]

Good day gentlemen,

Can this dagger be something good ??

It seems well done but the velvet is too much
and the damas blade seems weird on this kind of dagger.
Can it be spanish ??
Indian recent fake damas blade ??
do indians 'fake 'bladesmith'' make these models in recent reproductions ?
I didn't find any line this one.

Caveat emptor...

Kind regards

[francantolin]

Hello,
For me,
Bad late 20th indian reproduction

[Marius66]

Maybe the blade yes
But guard and pommel are really well made and seems not recent.
Any other thoughts ??

[fernando]

No offense Marius but, dare i say a decoration item all the way through; a letter opener maybe ? .

[Ed]

What did the seller represent it as?

[Marius66]

Originally Posted by Ed

What did the seller represent it as?

Thank you all for teh message
It said an old dagger in medieval style old reproduction
with real gold ans silver engravings.
Total length 52cm /20,4 inches long overall
long for a letter opener.
I thought about a theater dagger but too much chiselled and why a damas ( fake) blade ?

[Ed]

Originally Posted by Marius66

Thank you all for teh message
It said an old dagger in medieval style old reproduction
with real gold ans silver engravings.
Total length 52cm /20,4 inches long overall
long for a letter opener.
I thought about a theater dagger but too much chiselled and why a damas ( fake) blade ?

Well, Damascus blades are turned out by the thousand nowadays.

Copies can be quite nice. I would enjoy this one for what it is: a nicely done repro.

[Sajen]

I know next to nothing about European blades but could it be a 19th century Toledo dagger?
Attached is an example I found on the net.

[Marius66]

Thank's a lot Sajen,
That's the kind of steel damascening I was thinking about when I suggested Spanish dagger origin

I will try to remove the ( too ) fancy velvet/chape in scabbard and hilt if I can,
See how it is made under...

Kind regards

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Marius66

Thank's a lot Sajen,
That's the kind of steel damascening I was thinking about when I suggested Spanish dagger origin

I will try to remove the ( too ) fancy velvet/chape in scabbard and hilt if I can,
See how it is made under...

Kind regards

Hello Marius,

Yes, the velvet looks like it could be a later addition, keep us updated!

Regards,
Detlef

[fernando]

As this is an assumed replica, we now ought go move it to the Miscellania section !

[Marius66]

Hello Sajen,
I have removed the first mount and the inner scabbard is made of wood
Idem, in the hilt, under the velvet there is a wooden piece.

The small stones and pearls are well setted/made
Idem, I find the gold and silver damascenining quality made and show some age,
Just the pommel and the tip of the scabbard had been cleaned too much.
.
I have sanded and polished the blade, it was covered with some kind of wax to avoid rust so it looked too recent shiny and fake.
So it is a real damas blade don't know about the age but it is a real weapon ...

Fernando, can't we.put it.again in the european weapons forum ??
I saw 19th damas blade on french and german hunting daggers

[Marius66]

I like.the wild boar head,
Don't think it is a coat of arms / family crest.

a deco for a '' royal'' main gauche hunting dagger 😅

[Marius66]

Thank you very much Fernando !!

I found a mix of similar parts but nothing exactly look like...

Here a french hunting dagger with boars and damas blade

[Marius66]

Here the ''same'' kind of damascened steel


And old velvet covered parade swords or dagger

Some models with xxl historic importance...

[francantolin]

Hello Marius,

Really nice dagger !
The new pictures help a lot!
An high quality dagger certainly expensive but not old I guess,
For me made by a blacksmith in the second period of the 20th century.
PS: I'd like to get one like that

[Marius66]

I just want to add this picture,
The blade moves a little in the scabbard and the velvet is used/missing inside so I don't think all dagger and scabbard are so recent.

[francantolin]

Looking for my monogramms and Kaiser Willhelm II,
I found this german royal gift dagger with damas blade.

If it hadn't such an amazing history,
we could think it is just a recent reproduction

[Marius66]

Thank you Francantolin
for your imput !

I sharpened the edges and age the blade with a special trick ,
I find it looks older/ authentic now

[mariusgmioc]

This is a LATE 20th century ('60-'80) INDIAN reproduction.
The pattern welded damascus is of quite typical Indian type (low quality and mass produced) and so are the decorations. And NO, the fact that it has a pattern welded damascus blade does not make it a "real weapon" unless you consider wallhangers and letter openers "real weapons."
Now, you can believe what you want but this is my opinion.

[Marius66]

Hello Marius,
The Marius's war ,😁
That's what I asked in my first post ( indian damas...)
but I couldn't find any like this one.
I'm still not sure it is 19th/early 20th but it is strongly made and if it is mass produced it won't be difficult to find similar ones on internet, ebay...

PS: it's not my fault if your silver Phurba was placed in the miscellania forum and not considered no more as a weapon but a deco piece, I also have one and they are really well made and ethnics collectable items

[fernando]

Sorry Marius. We brought back your piece and so reopened a chance to find someone in the Euro forum with solid or common evidence that this is an actual weapon... on the contrary. Now it is time to send it back to Miscellania forum. This doesn not prevent the piece from being seen by members with some evidence or consensual opinion is presented over its authenticity.

[Marius66]

Ok thank you Fernando,
It's closed with the Phurba dagger,
I'd just like to receive pictures of these indian mass produced european medieval daggers for comparison precisely

[mariusgmioc]

Yes... Marius...
...but not war!

I meant the pattern welded damascus is mass produced not the dagger!
The dagger is manually and individually made, and so is the blade but from mass produced pattern welded billet.