Two Keris Swords for id please

tom22 · 30th June 2022, 07:16 PM

Hi All
Here is a couple of kris swords/daggers that i aquired recently ,I cant say i know alot about them , i believe they are bugis keris and look like they have some age , any more info will be much appreciated
Thanks

Gustav · 2nd July 2022, 11:48 PM

Yes, both are Bugis style because of the hexagonal cross section of the blade, but origin of both most probably is Southern coast of Sumatra. The darker hilt would be associated with Riau province, the light brown one could be from more Southern part of Sumatra, possibly Jambi.

Both blades are pre-1900, could be even pre-1880, the smaller one has a nice Pamor, similar to Javanese Pamor Rante. Unfortunately the tip of Sekar Kacang (or Belalai Gajah) on it is broken. That`s a pity, because Lambe Gajah and Pamor looks fine, it probably was a slightly better quality blade. Also the hilt cup is a finer one.

David · 6th July 2022, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gustav

That`s a pity, because Lambe Gajah and Pamor looks fine, it probably was a slightly better quality blade.

Gustav, does to appear to you as if the surface of these blades have been polished down somewhat? I would expect to see a more topographical surface on old Bugis blades like these.

Gustav · 6th July 2022, 08:58 PM

Yes David, there is a possibility for that.
I also thought about it.
The question is, if the time alone is responsible for the smoothened surface, or there has been a slight cleaning with polishing.

It would be interesting to know, if the blades were stained with Warangan. Old Warangan would still "bleed" out of the blade while soaking in pineaple juice. From my experience we more likely could expect Warangan on a blade, which wasn't excessively topographically etched.

I own a similar smaller blade with hexagonal cross section, which is smooth and has an old Warangan finish.

Gavin Nugent · 8th July 2022, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gustav

I own a similar smaller blade with hexagonal cross section, which is smooth and has an old Warangan finish.

I too have old Bugis Sulawesi and Bugis Sumatra blades with smooth surfaces and old Warangan.

The lighter coloured hulu is Jambi to my eye. From the photo, it seems the blade, hulu and pendokok have been apart at some stage.

The broken trunk, it was bought to my attention a while back, there are craftsmen repairing/replacing these areas with silver. Given silver can be blackened like the blades, it does seem an interesting proposition.

Gavin

SidJ · 10th July 2022, 02:53 PM

Pls can someone explain what Jambi is? Is it a type of wood or ivory? Thanks

Gustav · 10th July 2022, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gustav

The darker hilt would be associated with Riau province, the light brown one could be from more Southern part of Sumatra, possibly Jambi.

That should help.

David · 21st July 2022, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SidJ

Pls can someone explain what Jambi is? Is it a type of wood or ivory? Thanks

Jambi is a province in Sumatra.

SidJ · 23rd July 2022, 12:50 AM

Thanks for clarifying. I am grateful.

30th June 2022, 07:16 PM	#1
tom22 Member Join Date: Jun 2022 Posts: 15	Two Keris Swords for id please Hi All Here is a couple of kris swords/daggers that i aquired recently ,I cant say i know alot about them , i believe they are bugis keris and look like they have some age , any more info will be much appreciated Thanks Attached Images

2nd July 2022, 11:48 PM	#2
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,247	Yes, both are Bugis style because of the hexagonal cross section of the blade, but origin of both most probably is Southern coast of Sumatra. The darker hilt would be associated with Riau province, the light brown one could be from more Southern part of Sumatra, possibly Jambi. Both blades are pre-1900, could be even pre-1880, the smaller one has a nice Pamor, similar to Javanese Pamor Rante. Unfortunately the tip of Sekar Kacang (or Belalai Gajah) on it is broken. That`s a pity, because Lambe Gajah and Pamor looks fine, it probably was a slightly better quality blade. Also the hilt cup is a finer one.

6th July 2022, 08:58 PM	#4
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,247	Yes David, there is a possibility for that. I also thought about it. The question is, if the time alone is responsible for the smoothened surface, or there has been a slight cleaning with polishing. It would be interesting to know, if the blades were stained with Warangan. Old Warangan would still "bleed" out of the blade while soaking in pineaple juice. From my experience we more likely could expect Warangan on a blade, which wasn't excessively topographically etched. I own a similar smaller blade with hexagonal cross section, which is smooth and has an old Warangan finish.

10th July 2022, 02:53 PM	#6
SidJ Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 177	Pls can someone explain what Jambi is? Is it a type of wood or ivory? Thanks

23rd July 2022, 12:50 AM	#9
SidJ Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 177	Thanks for clarifying. I am grateful.