My second gunong...

russel · 14th April 2014, 11:02 AM

Hot on the heels of my first, comes my second Gunong! (Robert: it seems you were right, I DO have the bug!)

From my reading in this forum, would I be right in imagining early (20's-30's) 20th Century origin? It has seen better days, particularly the blade which has been quite mistreated. But it was the hilt that caught my eye...

I only have the seller's images for now.

I welcome all comments and suggestions.

Cheers, Russel

Sajen · 14th April 2014, 02:37 PM

Hello Russel,

a much later example as your first one. How long is it? Do you know already from which material the pommel is? Ivory, bone or tridacna?

Regards,
Detlef

russel · 14th April 2014, 09:21 PM

Hi Detlef, the seller doesn't know what the handle material is. I doubt it is bone. I suspect it is Tridacna.

russel · 14th April 2014, 09:21 PM

Of course it could be ivory, the images aren't quite clear enough for me to tell.

Robert · 15th April 2014, 02:27 AM

Hello Russel, I'm thinking that the hilt material on your new gunong looks more likely to be tridacna than ivory or bone. Now this is based only on the photos you have posted and because of their quality I could very easily be wrong. In the second photo where the hilt meets the ferrule there is a gap and the color of the material that can be seen there looks too white to me to be ivory. Also the overall soft look to the material remind me of oxidized shell more than it does of old dry ivory. I would say that this piece dates to the first quarter of the 20th century. My congratulation to you on this very nice new addition to your growing collection of gunongs.

I'll be very interested to see new photos of it after it arrives and you have had a chance to clean it up a bit just to see if the metal on the scabbard and ferrule are silver of not.

Best,
Robert

russel · 11th May 2014, 11:28 PM

My second gunong arrived safely. While I had my fingers crossed that the hilt would be Tridacna , I am nonetheless pleased that it is ivory. The attached image (in morning sunlight) clearly shows Schreger lines.

I am very pleased with my new addition. More photos to follow when better light permits.

Battara · 12th May 2014, 03:09 AM

Yup. That's elephant ivory........

russel · 12th May 2014, 03:26 AM

More photos as promised. I am curious what others think the central metal band on the scabbard may be made from. It certainly isn't silver. Nickel?

Robert · 12th May 2014, 05:55 AM

Wonderful, now that you have it in hand and there are clear photos I agree totally with Jose that it is indeed elephant ivory. As for the center section of the scabbard, could you show a photo of the seam, is it a hard metal or a very soft one? Could it possibly be made of a tin alloy like pewter?

Best,
Robert

Sajen · 12th May 2014, 09:58 AM

Hello Russel,
very nice gunong! Congats! Agree, clearly elephant ivory.
The middle section of the scabbard could be some sort of german silver.

Regards,
Detlef

Battara · 13th May 2014, 12:40 AM

Could very well be German silver, which is an alloy of nickel and copper. Doesn't oxidize like silver.

russel · 13th May 2014, 02:49 AM

Attached are images of the scabbard showing seams. The central portion doesn't seem to be soldered or brazed, looks more like resin holding it in place. It is quite a hard metal, thin and tinny (almost feels like aluminium). It does have a small amount of greenish corrosion: could this suggest that German Silver?

Battara · 14th May 2014, 12:41 AM

Yup - looks like German silver to me. Only way to know for sure is to have it tested by a jeweler.

Sajen · 25th October 2014, 11:16 AM

Hello Russel,

I am sure that you have given the gunong some maintenance in the meanwhile. Please can you post some pictures of the piece in the state it is now?

Regards,
Detlef

DaveA · 25th October 2014, 02:28 PM

I had my eye on that one too, but I held off on the suspicion that it might be ivory. With a few exceptions for well-documented antiques, it is illegal to own, purchase or transfer elephant ivory in the US. I didn't want to take the chance of this one getting intercepted at the border. Glad you have it safely tucked away!

Best Regards,

Dave A.

14th April 2014, 11:02 AM	#1
russel Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Tasmania, Australia Posts: 236	My second gunong... Hot on the heels of my first, comes my second Gunong! (Robert: it seems you were right, I DO have the bug!) From my reading in this forum, would I be right in imagining early (20's-30's) 20th Century origin? It has seen better days, particularly the blade which has been quite mistreated. But it was the hilt that caught my eye... I only have the seller's images for now. I welcome all comments and suggestions. Cheers, Russel Attached Images

11th May 2014, 11:28 PM	#6
russel Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Tasmania, Australia Posts: 236	Ivory! My second gunong arrived safely. While I had my fingers crossed that the hilt would be Tridacna , I am nonetheless pleased that it is ivory. The attached image (in morning sunlight) clearly shows Schreger lines. I am very pleased with my new addition. More photos to follow when better light permits. Attached Images Last edited by russel; 11th May 2014 at 11:29 PM. Reason: Spelling error

12th May 2014, 03:26 AM	#8
russel Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Tasmania, Australia Posts: 236	More photos as promised. I am curious what others think the central metal band on the scabbard may be made from. It certainly isn't silver. Nickel? Attached Images

13th May 2014, 02:49 AM	#12
russel Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Tasmania, Australia Posts: 236	Attached are images of the scabbard showing seams. The central portion doesn't seem to be soldered or brazed, looks more like resin holding it in place. It is quite a hard metal, thin and tinny (almost feels like aluminium). It does have a small amount of greenish corrosion: could this suggest that German Silver? Attached Images

25th October 2014, 02:28 PM	#15
DaveA Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Wisconsin, USA Posts: 413	Very nice! I had my eye on that one too, but I held off on the suspicion that it might be ivory. With a few exceptions for well-documented antiques, it is illegal to own, purchase or transfer elephant ivory in the US. I didn't want to take the chance of this one getting intercepted at the border. Glad you have it safely tucked away! Best Regards, Dave A.

14th April 2014, 02:37 PM	#2
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,797	Hello Russel, a much later example as your first one. How long is it? Do you know already from which material the pommel is? Ivory, bone or tridacna? Regards, Detlef

14th April 2014, 09:21 PM	#3
russel Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Tasmania, Australia Posts: 236	Hi Detlef, the seller doesn't know what the handle material is. I doubt it is bone. I suspect it is Tridacna.

15th April 2014, 02:27 AM	#5
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Hello Russel, I'm thinking that the hilt material on your new gunong looks more likely to be tridacna than ivory or bone. Now this is based only on the photos you have posted and because of their quality I could very easily be wrong. In the second photo where the hilt meets the ferrule there is a gap and the color of the material that can be seen there looks too white to me to be ivory. Also the overall soft look to the material remind me of oxidized shell more than it does of old dry ivory. I would say that this piece dates to the first quarter of the 20th century. My congratulation to you on this very nice new addition to your growing collection of gunongs. I'll be very interested to see new photos of it after it arrives and you have had a chance to clean it up a bit just to see if the metal on the scabbard and ferrule are silver of not. Best, Robert

12th May 2014, 03:09 AM	#7
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,229	Yup. That's elephant ivory........

12th May 2014, 05:55 AM	#9
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Wonderful, now that you have it in hand and there are clear photos I agree totally with Jose that it is indeed elephant ivory. As for the center section of the scabbard, could you show a photo of the seam, is it a hard metal or a very soft one? Could it possibly be made of a tin alloy like pewter? Best, Robert

12th May 2014, 09:58 AM	#10
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,797	Hello Russel, very nice gunong! Congats! Agree, clearly elephant ivory. The middle section of the scabbard could be some sort of german silver. Regards, Detlef

13th May 2014, 12:40 AM	#11
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,229	Could very well be German silver, which is an alloy of nickel and copper. Doesn't oxidize like silver.

14th May 2014, 12:41 AM	#13
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,229	Yup - looks like German silver to me. Only way to know for sure is to have it tested by a jeweler.

25th October 2014, 11:16 AM	#14
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,797	Hello Russel, I am sure that you have given the gunong some maintenance in the meanwhile. Please can you post some pictures of the piece in the state it is now? Regards, Detlef