3 Mystery Containers;Help !

drac2k · 20th June 2019, 08:47 PM

I recently picked up these 3 containers at auction and I was wondering if anyone knew what they were used for. The first one, the rectangular porcelain one, I am assuming is Chinese(because that is what was written on the tag and that is $75.00, not $7500.00); it has an old reddish residue in it, so I'm wondering if had some connection to painting or calligraphy. The next container is porcelain over metal, and quite large, so maybe it was a container for tea or sugar. It has a picture of a whimsical Oriental man, so it could be Chinese for the export market or even Dutch. Lastly, there is a small porcelain over metal container that may have been used for snuff.
If anybody knows what I have, please share the information.

kronckew · 21st June 2019, 09:43 AM

The first is a genuine container for ink blocks or wax, likely the date is right at 18thc Yung Cheng or Yong Zheng, depending on Mandarin etc or not, the red seal mark is an expert seal from China, so it is likely genuine.

The other 2 are broken fragments of, for the larger one a large baluster vase or something similar where the part of the broken original item has been cut and ground to make the lid of the silver alloy box, same again for the smaller one, it was common practice in later 19thc into the 20ths and sort of recycling of Ming and Qing antique porcelain that had been damaged.

In the Ming dynasty sherds of ceramic from the famous wares known as Chai ware in sky blue glaze with delicate crabs claw crackle markings were used in the imperial soldiers and officials cap - hat badges set into silver, they were excavated pieces of the most famous tang dynasty ceramic known to the Chinese as '' Chai yao '' chai kiln ware, the ware was often found in burials and tombs and re used for such things as cap hat badges because the actual kiln was never found and was apparently destroyed during the tang dynasty wars.
You can pretty much say that the Chinese have been recycling for a lot longer than us western white devils have.

All in all, probably worth a tad more than $75

I've improved the seal photo a bit so you can see the details easier.

drac2k · 21st June 2019, 04:36 PM

Thanks for your very informative answer !!!!

kronckew · 21st June 2019, 09:41 PM

Your welcome. You accidentally had something i knew about in advance.

My brain has cob-webby corners and secret rooms and drawers with all kinds of unusual things hidden in them. Not all useful, and some probably not even real.

asomotif · 25th June 2019, 12:54 PM

The 2nd type look a lot like one that I bought in a gift shop some 10 years ago. The fragment is old, but set into a new metal box/frame. very nice though. I use mine for name cards.

Best regards,
Willem

drac2k · 28th June 2019, 06:28 AM

Thanks; funny I never noticed these before and now it seems that I might be getting another one in with an Oriental lot that I just won at auction.

drac2k · 4th July 2019, 05:13 PM

And once you find a thing of interest, they seem to find you. Strangely enough, I encountered another piece in a group lot; it is somewhat larger, as it measures 6" x 9".After kronckew put me on the right path, I did a little research and found that they are still being made today, that the age varies as do the prices, so I will buy what I like and afford(hopefully), what I buy.

20th June 2019, 08:47 PM	#1
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,234	3 Mystery Containers;Help ! I recently picked up these 3 containers at auction and I was wondering if anyone knew what they were used for. The first one, the rectangular porcelain one, I am assuming is Chinese(because that is what was written on the tag and that is $75.00, not $7500.00); it has an old reddish residue in it, so I'm wondering if had some connection to painting or calligraphy. The next container is porcelain over metal, and quite large, so maybe it was a container for tea or sugar. It has a picture of a whimsical Oriental man, so it could be Chinese for the export market or even Dutch. Lastly, there is a small porcelain over metal container that may have been used for snuff. If anybody knows what I have, please share the information. Attached Images

21st June 2019, 09:43 AM	#2
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,187	The first is a genuine container for ink blocks or wax, likely the date is right at 18thc Yung Cheng or Yong Zheng, depending on Mandarin etc or not, the red seal mark is an expert seal from China, so it is likely genuine. The other 2 are broken fragments of, for the larger one a large baluster vase or something similar where the part of the broken original item has been cut and ground to make the lid of the silver alloy box, same again for the smaller one, it was common practice in later 19thc into the 20ths and sort of recycling of Ming and Qing antique porcelain that had been damaged. In the Ming dynasty sherds of ceramic from the famous wares known as Chai ware in sky blue glaze with delicate crabs claw crackle markings were used in the imperial soldiers and officials cap - hat badges set into silver, they were excavated pieces of the most famous tang dynasty ceramic known to the Chinese as '' Chai yao '' chai kiln ware, the ware was often found in burials and tombs and re used for such things as cap hat badges because the actual kiln was never found and was apparently destroyed during the tang dynasty wars. You can pretty much say that the Chinese have been recycling for a lot longer than us western white devils have. All in all, probably worth a tad more than $75 I've improved the seal photo a bit so you can see the details easier. Attached Images Last edited by kronckew; 21st June 2019 at 10:08 AM.

4th July 2019, 05:13 PM	#7
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,234	And once you find a thing of interest, they seem to find you. Strangely enough, I encountered another piece in a group lot; it is somewhat larger, as it measures 6" x 9".After kronckew put me on the right path, I did a little research and found that they are still being made today, that the age varies as do the prices, so I will buy what I like and afford(hopefully), what I buy. Attached Images

21st June 2019, 04:36 PM	#3
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,234	Thanks for your very informative answer !!!!

21st June 2019, 09:41 PM	#4
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,187	Your welcome. You accidentally had something i knew about in advance. My brain has cob-webby corners and secret rooms and drawers with all kinds of unusual things hidden in them. Not all useful, and some probably not even real.

25th June 2019, 12:54 PM	#5
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,225	The 2nd type look a lot like one that I bought in a gift shop some 10 years ago. The fragment is old, but set into a new metal box/frame. very nice though. I use mine for name cards. Best regards, Willem

28th June 2019, 06:28 AM	#6
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,234	Thanks; funny I never noticed these before and now it seems that I might be getting another one in with an Oriental lot that I just won at auction.