Kampilan dimension help please

[imas560]

Hello all
Long time lurker, first time poster.
I have been trawling through this site for awhile in regards to SEAsian edged weapons (especially items from the Philippines).
I am an active FMA practitioner and am currently concentrating on a kampilan/long staff form. The rattan 42" staff was proving a wee bit too light so I made a kampilan trainer based on live items and trainers I had seen.
Now I am in the situation where I want to refine the trainer's weight distribution.
I was hoping to get a few details from some live blades and I have seen some beauties on this forum.
My kampilan trainer stats are as follows:
Overall length = 43"
Blade length = 32.5"
Point of balance = 21.5" (11" in front of guard)
Weight = 2kg
If I could get a couple of stats from similar live blades I'll be able to adjust my trainer accordingly. I have included a picture of my trainer balanced on the rattan staff to show point of balance.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Many thanks

[Rick]

To a fast Kampilan .

Welcome .

I think the originals may vary widely .
I have two; both 19thC AFAIK .

The first one; POB 5.5" from crossguard .
Blade 29"
Max width, a skinny 2"
Two brass guards .
LOA 37"
Weight 2.25 #

The other:
POB 7.5" from crossguard
Blade, 28.5"
Max width, 1+11/16"
LOA, 38"
One steel guard .
Weight, 25 ounces .

A forum search under Kampilan will probably reveal both examples .

Rick

[Battara]

Mabuhay!

Well, I agree with Rick - the measurements and weights vary. I would give you mine, but it belonged to a sultan and will be a little heavier due to the ivory.

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by Battara

Mabuhay!

Well, I agree with Rick - the measurements and weights vary. I would give you mine, but it belonged to a sultan and will be a little heavier due to the ivory.

I would say the same as the example I have here far exceeds the size that Kampilan normally found in both blade length and hilt size.

Gavin

[Rick]

I reiterate; IMO distal taper is the key to a fast Kamp blade .

My blades, at their widest point are also at their thinnest, say a fat 1/16" thick ?

[Dimasalang]

May I ask what type of FMA you are taking? Just curious to know.

[Rick]

Originally Posted by freebooter

I would say the same as the example I have here far exceeds the size that Kampilan normally found in both blade length and hilt size.

Gavin

Fancy, is it ?

A Datu's Bearing Kampilan perhaps ?

Or a larger Man's sword ?

[imas560]

Thanks for the quick replies.
Am getting an approximate point of balance as my trainer is too front heavy (but not as top heavy as a axe). Especially interested in kampilans that may have been made for use.
Am training in Bahad Zu'bu with GM 'Yuli' Romo. He and his group have a couple of clips with staff and kampilan. From memory there is a clip of a kampilan demo that GM Yuli did in a public setting in P.I.
Also have seen a clip with Master Ricketts weilding a staff.
Hope I'm not straying too much into a FMA diversion on my first thread. Apologies if I have.
Also if my posts seem disjointed I have a 2 year old boy who requires "re-direction" every now and then.
Anyways were was I, yes kampilan trainer, am looking at altering the point of balance by drilling holes along the front top edge of the blade. The handle seems too short but am not going to change it as kampilan at 2kg is heavy, but it does mean I have to execute moves slowly and correctly.
Many thanks again for quick replies.

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by Rick

Fancy, is it ?

A Datu's Bearing Kampilan perhaps ?

Or a larger Man's sword ?

Sorry Rick, I thought you had seen it. Both I would think.

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...light=kampilan

Gav

[Rick]

Originally Posted by freebooter

Sorry Rick, I thought you had seen it. Both I would think.

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...light=kampilan

Gav

Now I remember !

imas, I believe the two Kamps I posted were made as combat pieces .

Rick

[imas560]

I found the photo of your two kampilans thanks Rick. Very nice.

[Maurice]

Originally Posted by Rick

Now I remember !

How is it possible to forget that one????

[Battara]

Oh yeah, Freebooter, that type is on my want list (the bells....the bells..... ).....

[imas560]

Well I found a post that migueldiaz contributed a collection of kampilan tips to.
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...light=kampilan
I had identified on my kampilan trainer a new point of balance that I would like (pink paper).

I set up to drill a series of 3.5mm holes at the front end of my trainer.

But I had made no difference to the point of balance

I didn't want to go past the sundi(?) so I enlarged the drill holes to 5mm which unfortunately when looked at in close up are too big

But when viewed as a whole they are not too overbearing

The change to the point of balance is also negligible

To make a significant change to point of balance I will have to go the distal taper route as suggested by Rick. I won't make a change to my trainer but the blank I have ready for my live version will undergo a fair bit of shaping and grinding. I'll most probably shape like a elongated diamond cross section starting from in front of the crossguard as my grinding skills aren't that hot.

[tom hyle]

Cross-section of originals I've handled is flat with an edge bevel at the base, with an unsharp rear bevel appearing towards the tip for a smoothly humped cross-section that is thin at both edges though sharp only at the front. This is the cutting area; thin and quite flexible.
My kampilan has a 31 inch blade, and even that seems a bit on the long side, averages-wise, but these blades would originally have been made to fit the user by some sort of biometric under which a modern person of European (for instance) ancestry might should properly use a considerably larger sword.

[tom hyle]

30 1/2" blade balance point is 7" in front of guard

[imas560]

thanks Tom