7th June 2019, 06:28 PM | #1 |
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My second bugis. Options on this one please
Hi all,
Bought my second bugis. I like the pamor. Seems a 9 luk if I look correct. Pamor ? a mixed one? I have no idea how old this keris is regards Pat Last edited by Patje1970; 7th June 2019 at 06:43 PM. Reason: correcting title |
7th June 2019, 06:36 PM | #2 |
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And some more pictures
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7th June 2019, 08:55 PM | #3 |
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The blade with 9 shallow waves looks old but not Bugis IMO, but maybe from West Java?
Regards |
7th June 2019, 09:23 PM | #4 | |
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Quote:
Can you explain why it not Bugis? I though it is a Bugis because of the urikan style regards Pat |
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7th June 2019, 10:34 PM | #5 |
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Yes, definitely not a Bugis blade, and very probably West Jawa.
Jean spoke first, so I'll leave the explanation to him. |
8th June 2019, 06:43 AM | #6 |
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thanks for the information, about the region of the urikan Sulawesi ?
About the blade, what pamor is this? I asume some kind of Wos Wutah at the base. Further on the blade something else. regards Pat |
8th June 2019, 06:45 AM | #7 |
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other close up pamor
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8th June 2019, 07:15 AM | #8 |
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This is an old blade, and it has been considerably eroded. The pamor when it was new was a random pattern pamor that had been surface manipulated, perhaps something like bendo sagodo or similar. It is possibly not a good idea to give it a definite name now.
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8th June 2019, 07:18 AM | #9 |
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According my keris book from Tammens, This keris looks like a Sumatra type. Is this correct?
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8th June 2019, 02:15 PM | #10 | |
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Regards |
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8th June 2019, 05:13 PM | #11 |
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Hi Alan and Jean,
thank you for al the information. regards Pat |
9th June 2019, 11:43 AM | #12 | |
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Quote:
What do you mean by urikan, is it ukiran (hilt)? IMO this blade is not Bugis for the following reasons (among others): . The dapur with the shallow and uneven waves and the slim shape is not Bugis but rather typical of West Java. . The pamor pattern is not typically Bugis. . The shape of the gonjo, pejetan, and greneng is not Bugis. Please see a similar blade on pic 1.4.69 in my kris book if you have it. Regards |
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9th June 2019, 11:49 AM | #13 |
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My similar blade for reference, regards.
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9th June 2019, 01:22 PM | #14 |
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I agree with everything Jean has written, and I would like to add a little.
For a pure Bugis blade the outstanding tell is that the blade cross section is hexagonal, the faces of the blade are wide and flat with a short, steep decline to the cutting edge. It is probable that in the hand, both the blade under discussion and Jean's blade would be classified as Segaluh, which is a West Javanese classification. |
9th June 2019, 02:23 PM | #15 | |
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Quote:
regards Pat Last edited by Patje1970; 9th June 2019 at 02:37 PM. Reason: adding info |
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9th June 2019, 07:26 PM | #16 | |
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Regards |
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9th June 2019, 10:48 PM | #17 |
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True Jean, and this mix of historic association, and geographic location is a source of ongoing misunderstanding and confusion.
Most keris blades are classified in accordance with geographic point of origin, but the name of a geographic point of origin can also refer to an era. Many people choose to understand the classification name as an historic era, rather than as a location. |
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