Sweet Lipps, naming of swords

Will M · 13th December 2022, 11:31 PM

I came across this and thought others may have come across similar references as it may have been common to name your sword.
I present : Sweet Lipps

https://digital.nls.uk/histories-of-...%2C2499%2C3503

Jim McDougall · 17th December 2022, 12:34 PM

The sword has often been termed affectionately the 'queen of weapons' and likely part of the well known convention of using the feminine pronoun 'she' for beloved inanimate things, cars, ships etc. in that sense.

In this case it seems more a euphemism for 'deadly' weapon used rather 'tongue in cheek', than an actual name for this particular sword.......in a sense like the much quoted movie phrase (referring to a gun)...'say hello to my little friend'.

Swords were indeed in select cases allegedly named by their owners, and of course most of these have been colorfully described in literature such as Excalibur, Joyuese, Tizona and many others belonging to historic or fictional characters.

The naming of swords in a personal sense would be quite a long discussion, but it is an interesting topic.

awdaniec666 · 18th December 2022, 10:38 PM

Interesting topic. I can only speak for the topic I spend most time with (Early modern period in central and east Europe). Going through contemporary memoirs of military men I never found evidence for naming the swords in this area and time-period specifically. But it seems like a thing they could have done, naming ships is something that has been done at least since the middle-ages for example. I wonder about the connection between epic stories and named swords, dramaturgy maybe?

Hotspur · 23rd December 2022, 10:57 PM

A Victorian list
https://www.bartleby.com/81/16143.html

Jim McDougall · 24th December 2022, 02:27 AM

[QUOTE=awdaniec666;277231]Interesting topic. I can only speak for the topic I spend most time with (Early modern period in central and east Europe). Going through contemporary memoirs of military men I never found evidence for naming the swords in this area and time-period specifically. But it seems like a thing they could have done, naming ships is something that has been done at least since the middle-ages for example. I wonder about the connection between epic stories and named swords, dramaturgy maybe?[/QUOTe

One of the first few books I owned in my early days of collecting, mid 60s, was "The Archaeology of Weapons". R.Ewart Oakshott, 1960, in its dedication it says. "..for NICK, who said, 'why not write a book?'.

Nick was none other than AVB 'Nick' Norman, who wrote the monumental "The Rapier and Small Sword 1460-1820", 1980.

On p.106, Oakshott;
"....another thing we find in the Norse tales is that all swords (and most spears and many axes too) are named. This is undoubtedly a custom going very far back, and in its earlier forms at least must have been closely associated with magic and the belief that all objects, as well as men and animate beings had souls, and that a name had great power in it".

further,
"...man has always been reluctant to abandon his ancient beliefs, and the swords personality seems to have stayed with it, though it was not often written about".

Actually, the names of swords and their personalities were indeed written about, the first coming to mind is always 'Excalibur', and the story behind that name is virtually the essence of Arthurian legend.

Oakeshott relates the Icelandic tale of the sword Skofnung, belonging to the 5-6th c. king Hrolf Kraki, buried with him in his grave. It was stolen from the grave by Skeggi and served generations onward. It had a charm called a life stone and there were many protocols and beliefs on the use of the sword.

With many of the Norse weapons, they had fearsome names like cleaver of limbs or other such graphic and psychologically horrific descriptive names.

With chivalry, thence later Victorian writing, swords were steeped in romance and the names were more in that accord.

Glen, excellent reference! and one can browse through it almost endlessly and it is almost addicting reading these terms that occur throughout literary history, with comprehensive lists of these famed and fabled sword names.

13th December 2022, 11:31 PM	#1
Will M Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: In the wee woods north of Napanee Ontario Posts: 391	Sweet Lipps, naming of swords I came across this and thought others may have come across similar references as it may have been common to name your sword. I present : Sweet Lipps https://digital.nls.uk/histories-of-...%2C2499%2C3503

17th December 2022, 12:34 PM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,945	The sword has often been termed affectionately the 'queen of weapons' and likely part of the well known convention of using the feminine pronoun 'she' for beloved inanimate things, cars, ships etc. in that sense. In this case it seems more a euphemism for 'deadly' weapon used rather 'tongue in cheek', than an actual name for this particular sword.......in a sense like the much quoted movie phrase (referring to a gun)...'say hello to my little friend'. Swords were indeed in select cases allegedly named by their owners, and of course most of these have been colorfully described in literature such as Excalibur, Joyuese, Tizona and many others belonging to historic or fictional characters. The naming of swords in a personal sense would be quite a long discussion, but it is an interesting topic.

18th December 2022, 10:38 PM	#3
awdaniec666 Member Join Date: May 2021 Location: Central Europe Posts: 166	Interesting topic. I can only speak for the topic I spend most time with (Early modern period in central and east Europe). Going through contemporary memoirs of military men I never found evidence for naming the swords in this area and time-period specifically. But it seems like a thing they could have done, naming ships is something that has been done at least since the middle-ages for example. I wonder about the connection between epic stories and named swords, dramaturgy maybe?

23rd December 2022, 10:57 PM	#4
Hotspur Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Nipmuc USA Posts: 498	A Victorian list https://www.bartleby.com/81/16143.html

24th December 2022, 02:27 AM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,945	[QUOTE=awdaniec666;277231]Interesting topic. I can only speak for the topic I spend most time with (Early modern period in central and east Europe). Going through contemporary memoirs of military men I never found evidence for naming the swords in this area and time-period specifically. But it seems like a thing they could have done, naming ships is something that has been done at least since the middle-ages for example. I wonder about the connection between epic stories and named swords, dramaturgy maybe?[/QUOTe One of the first few books I owned in my early days of collecting, mid 60s, was "The Archaeology of Weapons". R.Ewart Oakshott, 1960, in its dedication it says. "..for NICK, who said, 'why not write a book?'. Nick was none other than AVB 'Nick' Norman, who wrote the monumental "The Rapier and Small Sword 1460-1820", 1980. On p.106, Oakshott; "....another thing we find in the Norse tales is that all swords (and most spears and many axes too) are named. This is undoubtedly a custom going very far back, and in its earlier forms at least must have been closely associated with magic and the belief that all objects, as well as men and animate beings had souls, and that a name had great power in it". further, "...man has always been reluctant to abandon his ancient beliefs, and the swords personality seems to have stayed with it, though it was not often written about". Actually, the names of swords and their personalities were indeed written about, the first coming to mind is always 'Excalibur', and the story behind that name is virtually the essence of Arthurian legend. Oakeshott relates the Icelandic tale of the sword Skofnung, belonging to the 5-6th c. king Hrolf Kraki, buried with him in his grave. It was stolen from the grave by Skeggi and served generations onward. It had a charm called a life stone and there were many protocols and beliefs on the use of the sword. With many of the Norse weapons, they had fearsome names like cleaver of limbs or other such graphic and psychologically horrific descriptive names. With chivalry, thence later Victorian writing, swords were steeped in romance and the names were more in that accord. Glen, excellent reference! and one can browse through it almost endlessly and it is almost addicting reading these terms that occur throughout literary history, with comprehensive lists of these famed and fabled sword names.