Arabian Sword Dances (And other dances!)

A.alnakkas · 23rd March 2012, 11:00 PM

Just thought this will be interesting to post:

1- Najdi Ardha:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9NgnthZu18 (best performance I found. So you think you can dance King Abdullah version.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgcYC...feature=fvwrel (this one is nice too)

2- Ardha Janoobiya - Southern Ardha:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJVtc...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBvaw...eature=related (Michael bin Jackson

)

3- Ardhat Bisha:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cV7LlHVsPv4 (Videos on the side are not all viewer's friendly, so please avoid drifting into the darkside of Youtube.)

4- Ardha Qatariya:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAa9S...eature=related

5- Ardhat Ala alZeer (Utaiba tribe, more on this later)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v82vHdRz7-Q

6- Zamil of southern Arabia:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WhLu...eature=related

----

More will be added later, I dont claim to be an expert on these dances and do not know when they are done (as I am sure some of them are done in certain occasions, the Zamil for example.. as far as I know is done when 2 tribes meet)

Dom · 24th March 2012, 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

and do not know when they are done (as I am sure some of them are done in certain occasions

for sure

à +

Dom

kahnjar1 · 24th March 2012, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom

for sure

à +

Dom

...this surely has to be an illustration for a quiz question WHAT HAPPENED NEXT?....................

kronckew · 24th March 2012, 11:15 AM

us 'mericans also have a sword dance.

Bush Sword Dance

English sword dance

note the flexible blades and lack of guards

Morris Dancers
Yorkshire long sword dancers
More, with some history

Scots version - somewhat more ostentatious & using real swords.

Edinburg Tattoo Sword Dance

russian version

guardless swords...

Russian dance

Devadatta · 24th March 2012, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

russian version

guardless swords...

Russian dance

Because they are cossack shashkas and were used far not only for dance during the history

I agree however that the particular swords in hands of the dancers in the video provided are modern-made theater/dance replicas, not authentic pieces of course. But they have historic battle-ready prototype.

David R · 26th March 2012, 12:50 AM

Fascinating videos , I would love to know more about the context of these, ref. the stuff from the Islamic world. Re the UK, worth remembering that we lost so many young men in WW1 that for a generation the Morris dancing tradition was kept alive by womens teams, and so we may have lost some of the nuances of that form.

kronckew · 26th March 2012, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David R

Fascinating videos , I would love to know more about the context of these, ref. the stuff from the Islamic world. Re the UK, worth remembering that we lost so many young men in WW1 that for a generation the Morris dancing tradition was kept alive by womens teams, and so we may have lost some of the nuances of that form.

we probably lost as many if not more in the flu plague/pandemic shortly after.

many of the silly looking traditions like morris dancing, may pole, hobby horse and such had darker and more martial aspects in the past.

modern living, occupational health and safety regs have had an even more deleterious effect.

so have the greenies and animal rights groupies. it was noted in one of the uk videos that there were only 4 longsword dancing teams left in yorkshire out of many hundreds in the past.

(In the Bush dance i really like the swords he and the Saudi King were using. no dancing blades those.)

A.alnakkas · 26th March 2012, 02:09 PM

Its not unusual to find over-polished clauberg blade on Ardha saifs.

kronckew · 26th March 2012, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

Its not unusual to find over-polished clauberg blade on Ardha saifs.

a lot of the more recently made 'dancing saifs' i saw in saudi were shiney with bling silver and gold mounts and scabbards, but looked like the blade was not really functional. guess the newer ardha participants like to show off a bit, as the thobe & gutrah is fairly standardised, i guess this is one way.

Bush's saif seems a bit more curved than the king's. wonder how sharp it was...

Probably would look better with an etch if it's damascus or wootz.
Most politicians like sparkly things; comes from putting a shine on everything they say...

A.alnakkas · 26th March 2012, 05:03 PM

Hey,

I doubt Bush is wielding a wootz blade. Keep in mind that I even doubt he is wielding a clauberg.

At best, this could be a king Faisal era ardha saif as they were very faithful to the clauberg (named Gasat al Askari or Bu askari) BUT I did see the king Faisal saif's with older blades :P

The best sword I have seen in an Ardha was one I saw a few weeks ago here in Kuwait. Some Kuwaiti ambassador dancing with a persian wootz (most likely) blade with golden fittings.

As for the saudi guy, he is not the king.. but most of the images I found of King Abdullah he is usually wielding the recent ardha saifs which have slim but forged, flexible blades. Those blades looks exactly like the one wielded by Bush.

kronckew · 26th March 2012, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

Hey,

...

As for the saudi guy, he is not the king.. but most of the images I found of King Abdullah he is usually wielding the recent ardha saifs which have slim but forged, flexible blades.

i wasn't sure if he was or not. there were so many saudi princes, i get them all confused...

somehow i don't think GWB would even know what wootz is. certainly our current irishman o'bama wouldn't. (i've edited my post above a tad while you were posting

.)

A.alnakkas · 26th March 2012, 05:10 PM

Included are pictures of an Ardha badawi saif with a fake Clauberg stamp. The blade is forged but slim and flexible. This is very recent work done in Ta'if, I may get one soon as a dress sword with a crown stamp that says "made in france" :P

A.alnakkas · 26th March 2012, 05:15 PM

Here is the "king Faisal era" ardha saifs, they could be earlier then king Faisal and they have forged and usable blades.

A.alnakkas · 26th March 2012, 05:20 PM

Picture of a saif with an older blade and modern fittings (likely king Faisal or earlier)

This one is owned by ALEX and the previous one is owned by Eftihis.

kronckew · 26th March 2012, 05:21 PM

sadly i did not manage to buy any saudi items when i was there. al khobar & dammam did not seem to have very many shops that carried anything beyond tarnished silver daggers then. i had a friend in dammam that probably could have located the real stuff for me, but back then i was not as knowledgeable & was more interested in getting a traditionally made katana in japan.

i love the fullers on the one ALEX has...

the only islamic-ish curved sword i own, i have no idea where or when it comes from...

A.alnakkas · 26th March 2012, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

sadly i did not manage to buy any saudi items when i was there. al khobar & dammam did not seem to have very many shops that carried anything beyond tarnished silver daggers then. i had a friend in dammam that probably could have located the real stuff for me, but back then i was not as knowledgeable & was more interested in getting a traditionally made katana in japan.

i love the fullers on the one ALEX has...

the only islamic-ish sword i own, i have no idea where or when it comes from...

When did you live in KSA? one of the best sword dealers in the gulf lives in Dammam ;-) he owns some Tulwars with wootz blades last time I checked but he doesnt have any badawi saifs.

kronckew · 26th March 2012, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

When did you live in KSA? one of the best sword dealers in the gulf lives in Dammam ;-) he owns some Tulwars with wootz blades last time I checked but he doesnt have any badawi saifs.

I was in Dhahran (Aramco of course) from 1980-87 & spent another year in Dammam in 1995 with M. Al-Mojil. part of the time with Aramco i was in Safaniyah as a project engineer on the desalting plant we were building there. drove up towards Kuwait one weekend and turned around a bit short of where the uniforms started getting a bit scary. that was as close as i got to Kuwait.

The last time in Dammam, i did spend a lot of time wandering around the souks, but I must either have missed seeing that dealer's shop somehow, or he was not in business then. i was working 10 hr days 6 days a week, so i was a bit worn out by the time i got some free time.

A.alnakkas · 8th January 2013, 05:00 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o0P14p8Eew

Aldaha of Eniza tribe, the largest and one of the most prestigious of Arabian tribes.

The story behind the daha is that at some time a larger raid was about to attack Eniza. The men of Eniza being outnumbered (they were less in the past!) they came up with the idea of doing this dance. Their sounds were like that of a larger army so the attacking raid turned tail and escaped!

The men dancing infront of the row are taking the role that women used to do before. The women of the tribe would do that to remind the men that incase they lose, they will be taken by the invaders.

A.alnakkas · 12th July 2013, 03:34 AM

Here is an old video and a chance to actually see someone who engaged in sword combat and has old warfare experience doing the ardha dance:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7orax704PqM

The elder in the middle (wearing red shmagh and golden egal) from 00:50 + is shaikh Abdullah alJaber AlSabah of Kuwait. He fought in the battle of alJahra in the early 20th century. Anyone with some experience in the dance will notice that he is infact leading and controlling the other dancers, something very rare in our time especially as the elderly people are passing away :-(

A.alnakkas · 17th September 2013, 06:11 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfayu5r-Na4

This is an excellent video showing the Qatari variation of the Ardha.

Note at 0:50 it shows a glimpse of an art that seems restricted to Qatar and Bahrain called Mhayal. Its a duel in which the dancers try to knock eachother's egals (headband) using real sharp swords. I spoke about it with my Qatari friends and hoping to get a full video of it.

Iain · 21st September 2013, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.alnakkas

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfayu5r-Na4

This is an excellent video showing the Qatari variation of the Ardha.

Note at 0:50 it shows a glimpse of an art that seems restricted to Qatar and Bahrain called Mhayal. Its a duel in which the dancers try to knock eachother's egals (headband) using real sharp swords. I spoke about it with my Qatari friends and hoping to get a full video of it.

Any word on that vid?

Sounds interesting.

23rd March 2012, 11:00 PM	#1
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Arabian Sword Dances (And other dances!) Just thought this will be interesting to post: 1- Najdi Ardha: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9NgnthZu18 (best performance I found. So you think you can dance King Abdullah version.) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgcYC...feature=fvwrel (this one is nice too) 2- Ardha Janoobiya - Southern Ardha: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJVtc...eature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBvaw...eature=related (Michael bin Jackson ) 3- Ardhat Bisha: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cV7LlHVsPv4 (Videos on the side are not all viewer's friendly, so please avoid drifting into the darkside of Youtube.) 4- Ardha Qatariya: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAa9S...eature=related 5- Ardhat Ala alZeer (Utaiba tribe, more on this later) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v82vHdRz7-Q 6- Zamil of southern Arabia: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WhLu...eature=related ---- More will be added later, I dont claim to be an expert on these dances and do not know when they are done (as I am sure some of them are done in certain occasions, the Zamil for example.. as far as I know is done when 2 tribes meet)

24th March 2012, 11:15 AM	#4
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,184	us 'mericans also have a sword dance. Bush Sword Dance English sword dance note the flexible blades and lack of guards Morris Dancers Yorkshire long sword dancers More, with some history Scots version - somewhat more ostentatious & using real swords. Edinburg Tattoo Sword Dance russian version guardless swords... Russian dance Last edited by kronckew; 24th March 2012 at 12:02 PM.

26th March 2012, 05:10 PM	#12
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Included are pictures of an Ardha badawi saif with a fake Clauberg stamp. The blade is forged but slim and flexible. This is very recent work done in Ta'if, I may get one soon as a dress sword with a crown stamp that says "made in france" :P Attached Images

26th March 2012, 05:15 PM	#13
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Here is the "king Faisal era" ardha saifs, they could be earlier then king Faisal and they have forged and usable blades. Attached Images

26th March 2012, 05:20 PM	#14
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Picture of a saif with an older blade and modern fittings (likely king Faisal or earlier) This one is owned by ALEX and the previous one is owned by Eftihis. Attached Images

26th March 2012, 12:50 AM	#6
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,079	Fascinating videos , I would love to know more about the context of these, ref. the stuff from the Islamic world. Re the UK, worth remembering that we lost so many young men in WW1 that for a generation the Morris dancing tradition was kept alive by womens teams, and so we may have lost some of the nuances of that form.

26th March 2012, 02:09 PM	#8
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Its not unusual to find over-polished clauberg blade on Ardha saifs.

26th March 2012, 05:03 PM	#10
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Hey, I doubt Bush is wielding a wootz blade. Keep in mind that I even doubt he is wielding a clauberg. At best, this could be a king Faisal era ardha saif as they were very faithful to the clauberg (named Gasat al Askari or Bu askari) BUT I did see the king Faisal saif's with older blades :P The best sword I have seen in an Ardha was one I saw a few weeks ago here in Kuwait. Some Kuwaiti ambassador dancing with a persian wootz (most likely) blade with golden fittings. As for the saudi guy, he is not the king.. but most of the images I found of King Abdullah he is usually wielding the recent ardha saifs which have slim but forged, flexible blades. Those blades looks exactly like the one wielded by Bush.

26th March 2012, 05:21 PM	#15
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,184	sadly i did not manage to buy any saudi items when i was there. al khobar & dammam did not seem to have very many shops that carried anything beyond tarnished silver daggers then. i had a friend in dammam that probably could have located the real stuff for me, but back then i was not as knowledgeable & was more interested in getting a traditionally made katana in japan. i love the fullers on the one ALEX has... the only islamic-ish curved sword i own, i have no idea where or when it comes from... Attached Images Last edited by kronckew; 26th March 2012 at 05:32 PM.

8th January 2013, 05:00 PM	#18
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o0P14p8Eew Aldaha of Eniza tribe, the largest and one of the most prestigious of Arabian tribes. The story behind the daha is that at some time a larger raid was about to attack Eniza. The men of Eniza being outnumbered (they were less in the past!) they came up with the idea of doing this dance. Their sounds were like that of a larger army so the attacking raid turned tail and escaped! The men dancing infront of the row are taking the role that women used to do before. The women of the tribe would do that to remind the men that incase they lose, they will be taken by the invaders.

12th July 2013, 03:34 AM	#19
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Here is an old video and a chance to actually see someone who engaged in sword combat and has old warfare experience doing the ardha dance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7orax704PqM The elder in the middle (wearing red shmagh and golden egal) from 00:50 + is shaikh Abdullah alJaber AlSabah of Kuwait. He fought in the battle of alJahra in the early 20th century. Anyone with some experience in the dance will notice that he is infact leading and controlling the other dancers, something very rare in our time especially as the elderly people are passing away :-(

17th September 2013, 06:11 PM	#20
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfayu5r-Na4 This is an excellent video showing the Qatari variation of the Ardha. Note at 0:50 it shows a glimpse of an art that seems restricted to Qatar and Bahrain called Mhayal. Its a duel in which the dancers try to knock eachother's egals (headband) using real sharp swords. I spoke about it with my Qatari friends and hoping to get a full video of it.