![]() |
![]() |
#1 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]()
Dear forumites,
I have found two lantakas in an antiqueshop which I like very much. But because I have not much experience with them, maybe somebody can tell me specific things which can distinguish a good from a fake one.... Also I would like to know if there are books writen about lantaka's. Any suggestions? Thanks for your help in advance! Maurice Last edited by Maurice; 20th December 2009 at 07:45 AM. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#2 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,209
|
![]()
Maurice,
Maybe you can take some pictures of these lantakas. That would help a lot i think. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Holland
Posts: 242
|
![]()
Maurice,
Send the photo,s to willem . i think he can help you with this question. Greetz, Danny |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4 | |
Keris forum moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 7,085
|
![]() Quote:
![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#5 |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]()
David, there are living more Willems in the Netherlands.
![]() Danny is not reffering to asomotif. But I guess the other Willem is lurking too once in a while. Unfortunately I don't have pics. I was quick at a real old dusty antique gallery. I have seen the lantaka's lying behind a sideboard. I couldn't reach for the lantaka's to give it a closer look, but it looked like they had nice old patina. I had very little time because I was there for other business ![]() Anyone know anything about books?? Maurice |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#6 | |
Keris forum moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 7,085
|
![]() Quote:
![]() I would think that if you are truly interested in these lantakas that you will return to the shop and ask for a closer look. You should get some photos then and post them. I think it would be really hard to comment without seeing them. ![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#7 | |
Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 2,222
|
![]() Quote:
Let's say "Big Willem" ![]() ![]() I have no knowledge of lantaka's at all. i already PM -ed Maurice. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#8 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,209
|
![]()
In that case it would be nice if Maurice would post the pictures and the comments of "Big Willem" as well.
After all we all are very curious ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#9 | |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]() Quote:
I will send the other Willem an email if he knows books of lantaka's. I will let you know. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#10 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC, U.S.A.
Posts: 2,086
|
![]()
Wow...definitely a loaded question considering there are true old ones, ones that were used only as a form of currency all the way up into the 20th century, ones that were used as wedding doweries/gifts (to my understanding, these cheaper made pieces are like symbolic pieces, like a Victorian copy of earlier piece) and, of course, modern fakes. I know very little how to spot the fakes, but it is my understanding that the older ones were typically plainer than the more modern and currency models (lacking the dolphin and dragon decorations, etc). Likewise, the ones used as true firing pieces had their trunnions set low on the pieces so thay could be used as true swivel-type rail guns (meaning, I have seen some of the modern faux-verdigris guns with trunnions directly extending from their sides, thus, not true swivels as the lantankas were intended to be). Also adding to the confusion is that the larger of the pieces were true weapons whereas the smaller ones were just signallers. What length constituting which was a fighter and which wasn't hasn't been made clear to me in any of my research. Sorry if this causes more confusion than answers-
![]() Look for true signs of wear and aging, including inside the barrel. Perhaps look up how the new ones are given fake green patina and how to spot it. ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#11 | |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]() Quote:
Can you tell something about the source of your research? Maybe I have more questions now after reading your story, but the more questions to nail down, the more knowledge after finding the answers! ![]() The wear and aging of wooden, bone and ivory swordhandles I can recognize. But to recognize old bronze patina is a limitation I still have, want and need to learn. Can anyone post examples of good bronze patina, and fake bronze patina? Rg, Maurice |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#12 | |
Keris forum moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 7,085
|
![]() Quote:
![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#13 | |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]() Quote:
What I meant (but didn't write) is that it is a real dark antiquestorage. Almost no light is coming through the little windows, so it would be hard to show the patina. I will contact him as soon as the holidays are over to make an appointment to shoot some pictures, because he is closed already for this year... |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#14 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,186
|
![]()
Maurice, you mentioned literature on lantaka. Unfortunately the literature is scarce. One source is THE KERIS AND OTHER WEAPONS by Gardner. There is also a book by Alex Teoh called THE MIGHT OF THE MINIATURE CANNON. Another good source of information is this link and resource: www.cannonsuperstore.com (scoll down to the cannon info and fake cannon info)
These and some research have guided me in my procuring my mini-lantaka, making sure it is not a fake and having appropriate patina. True bronze will have a brown-black patina first, then perhaps some blue green. Other aspects can be found from these resources. Hope this helps. ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#15 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,186
|
![]()
Oh yes, I forgot, there is also this: www.bronzecannons.net/ cannon_journal.html
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#16 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 999
|
![]()
Brunei Museum had published a couple of articles regarding Lantakas. One article written by Shariffuddin (sp?), and one by Tom Harrison. Sariffuddin wrote extensively ,from history and origin, classifications and terminology of Lantakas in the Brunei museum. I recall seeing a few plates from miniatures to kabau and crocodile forms.
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#17 | ||
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]() Quote:
Quote:
|
||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#18 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 191
|
![]()
I found this information:
BRUNEI MUSEUM JOURNAL : Vol.1, No.1 1969 CONTENTS ............ ETHNOLOGY & PREHISTORY 5. SUNGAI LUMUT : 15th CENTURY BURIAL GROUND by Barbara Harrison & P. M.Sharifuddin 6. THE GOLDEN HOARD OF LIMBANG by Tom Harrisson 7. BRUNEI CANNON by P. M. Sharifuddin 8. BRUNEI CANNON – THEIR ROLE IN SOUTHEAST ASIA by Tom Harrison HISTORY 9. BRUNEI AND THE MORO WAR by F. Delor Angeles ............ Publication Section Brunei Museums Department Main Office: National Archives Building Jalan Menteri Besar Brunei Darussalam Tel: 673-2381672/7 Tel: 673-2384371 E-mail: bmcomm@brunet.bn http://www.museums.gov.bn/bmj69.htm |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#19 | |
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,324
|
![]() Quote:
I will send an email right away to them. Regards, Maurice |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
|
|