medieval clubs?

ausjulius · 11th February 2015, 02:22 AM

i am interested in information about different patterns of club used in europe actually then or before or after..

typically in depicitions you see only the stereotypical studded or spiked knobbed wooden clubs .. giant weapons specifically for warfare. but i wonder what other styles exist.

i have seen images showing edged clubs some what like those of tonga or samoa being used in a image of trial by combat.
http://www.thetrial.net/Ordeals.htm
http://www.historicalfencing.com/Tal...Book-Blog.html
http://www.aemma.org/onlineResources..._and_woman.htm

there seems in these images a clear specific style of pointed bladed club used.

and also seen images if woodcuts showing throwing clubs used by people for sport ..
there is even a specific type of small club named cokstele for cock throwing .. such a name it had.. indeed..
ive never seen a good depiction of one and only ever seen them refered as a weighted stick..

has anyone have better images of such clubs or other information..

id say outside of this the shillelagh has to be a good example of a european rootball club... as older ones ive seen are all clearly rootballs and heavy weapons not walking sticks..

i wounder if there was anyother clubs or club like weapons than lingered onin european culture ...
i supposethe flexabe cosh type weapons may be examples.. to a degree..

colin henshaw · 12th February 2015, 02:26 PM

I believe wooden clubs or "cudgels" were carried by the country people or peasantry in the Middle Ages in Europe and probably later, however I have no images to post. Of course metal maces or "morning stars" were used in battles by warriors. No doubt camp followers would have cudgels and knives etc., for use when looting battlefields etc.

I'm sure the specialists in European arms and armour can give better information.

ausjulius · 12th February 2015, 09:52 PM

yeah i have seen many war clubs i museums or pole clubs or what is the technical term.. clubs with a spiked tip and length of 5 feet or more and inron sikes..
really weponry for smashing armored persons . you can seen in cenrtal europe in museums some good examples of these battle clubs i guess poor guns would be given such stuff and to behones the weight of them and the steel spikes they would work just fine..
i know the japanese had a similar weapon.. but the japanese also made small single handed ones for persons to use for self defence..

in the picute of tribal by combat in the links in my post above i clearly shows a style of club that more like some sort of aboriginal or polyneisan club than your typical european weapon.. more specalised as a club for single handed use..

in the image some times to looks to be slimmer and edged or rounded hard to say.. but it is most interesting a weapon..

i wounder in anyone else has more pictures of this weapon..

Enmetena · 19th February 2015, 10:25 AM

Depiction of a Cossack from 1701 and similar clubs excavated at Berestechko battle site (1651).

There is also description by Kitowicz of how polish peasants made their clubs studded with flint shards. In original:

Laska drewniana krzemieniem nasadzana; który krzemień zasadzali za skóre drzewa na pniu stojącego; gdy już dobrze wrósł krzemień w drzewo, dopiero go spuszczali i lasko robili.

My translation:

Wooden staff studded with flint; this flint they put behind bark of growing tree; after it is well grown into the tree, they cut it and make a staff.

ausjulius · 21st February 2015, 12:45 AM

wow thanks very interesting information..

do you have any images or reconstructions of the polish club..

it seems a very specific process to make a clube for them to select a saplingand then insert the flint and wait some year and gather clubs.

i would presume there was quite some culture around the production of such clubs as it is far more time consuming than making a spear or sword or simple iron mace.. considering the aging time once cut.. id think it would be about 4-5years or so form the time they put the flint in till when they have a club,

most interesting i wounder if the large knobs on the medival war clubs are all caused by flint shards.. i would be tempted to x-ray one to find out if i hade access to them (although i suspect most you see in castles are modern reproductions or form later eras 1600s ect. pesants weapons make in emergency...??

about the cossack club!!

thanksdidnt know this very intereting to see as well looks the same as an east african ringu club...
i wounder if these were typically thrown .. as this shape works best as a throwing club.

Andi · 21st February 2015, 09:43 AM

Wooden clubs are often depicted in connection with Wild Men in medieval artworks. Wild men were representing mythical figures and being a symbol of the romantic good old archaic times

11th February 2015, 02:22 AM	#1
ausjulius Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: musorian territory Posts: 422	medieval clubs? i am interested in information about different patterns of club used in europe actually then or before or after.. typically in depicitions you see only the stereotypical studded or spiked knobbed wooden clubs .. giant weapons specifically for warfare. but i wonder what other styles exist. i have seen images showing edged clubs some what like those of tonga or samoa being used in a image of trial by combat. http://www.thetrial.net/Ordeals.htm http://www.historicalfencing.com/Tal...Book-Blog.html http://www.aemma.org/onlineResources..._and_woman.htm there seems in these images a clear specific style of pointed bladed club used. and also seen images if woodcuts showing throwing clubs used by people for sport .. there is even a specific type of small club named cokstele for cock throwing .. such a name it had.. indeed.. ive never seen a good depiction of one and only ever seen them refered as a weighted stick.. has anyone have better images of such clubs or other information.. id say outside of this the shillelagh has to be a good example of a european rootball club... as older ones ive seen are all clearly rootballs and heavy weapons not walking sticks.. i wounder if there was anyother clubs or club like weapons than lingered onin european culture ... i supposethe flexabe cosh type weapons may be examples.. to a degree..

19th February 2015, 10:25 AM	#4
Enmetena Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 7	Depiction of a Cossack from 1701 and similar clubs excavated at Berestechko battle site (1651). There is also description by Kitowicz of how polish peasants made their clubs studded with flint shards. In original: Laska drewniana krzemieniem nasadzana; który krzemień zasadzali za skóre drzewa na pniu stojącego; gdy już dobrze wrósł krzemień w drzewo, dopiero go spuszczali i lasko robili. My translation: Wooden staff studded with flint; this flint they put behind bark of growing tree; after it is well grown into the tree, they cut it and make a staff. Attached Images

21st February 2015, 09:43 AM	#6
Andi Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Halstenbek, Germany Posts: 203	Wooden clubs are often depicted in connection with Wild Men in medieval artworks. Wild men were representing mythical figures and being a symbol of the romantic good old archaic times Attached Images

12th February 2015, 02:26 PM	#2
colin henshaw Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,430	I believe wooden clubs or "cudgels" were carried by the country people or peasantry in the Middle Ages in Europe and probably later, however I have no images to post. Of course metal maces or "morning stars" were used in battles by warriors. No doubt camp followers would have cudgels and knives etc., for use when looting battlefields etc. I'm sure the specialists in European arms and armour can give better information.

12th February 2015, 09:52 PM	#3
ausjulius Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: musorian territory Posts: 422	yeah i have seen many war clubs i museums or pole clubs or what is the technical term.. clubs with a spiked tip and length of 5 feet or more and inron sikes.. really weponry for smashing armored persons . you can seen in cenrtal europe in museums some good examples of these battle clubs i guess poor guns would be given such stuff and to behones the weight of them and the steel spikes they would work just fine.. i know the japanese had a similar weapon.. but the japanese also made small single handed ones for persons to use for self defence.. in the picute of tribal by combat in the links in my post above i clearly shows a style of club that more like some sort of aboriginal or polyneisan club than your typical european weapon.. more specalised as a club for single handed use.. in the image some times to looks to be slimmer and edged or rounded hard to say.. but it is most interesting a weapon.. i wounder in anyone else has more pictures of this weapon..

21st February 2015, 12:45 AM	#5
ausjulius Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: musorian territory Posts: 422	wow thanks very interesting information.. do you have any images or reconstructions of the polish club.. it seems a very specific process to make a clube for them to select a saplingand then insert the flint and wait some year and gather clubs. i would presume there was quite some culture around the production of such clubs as it is far more time consuming than making a spear or sword or simple iron mace.. considering the aging time once cut.. id think it would be about 4-5years or so form the time they put the flint in till when they have a club, most interesting i wounder if the large knobs on the medival war clubs are all caused by flint shards.. i would be tempted to x-ray one to find out if i hade access to them (although i suspect most you see in castles are modern reproductions or form later eras 1600s ect. pesants weapons make in emergency...?? about the cossack club!! thanksdidnt know this very intereting to see as well looks the same as an east african ringu club... i wounder if these were typically thrown .. as this shape works best as a throwing club.