Nice Kris

Spunjer · 1st March 2011, 08:23 PM

i always wonder why naga symbols are found on barung and not on krises. yes, there are krises with naga incised on the wide part of the blade, but i haven't seen a talismanic symbol of the naga itself on the blade. i figure it's out there somewhere, and it's just a matter of time before i'd see pictures of it. well, what do you know? the moros of yore prolly heard my crazy conundrum, so lo and behold, they sent their redhead southern brethren from north carolina to deliver a kris so full of nagas that this baby must have been Medusa's sword:
gentlemen, i introduce to you one heck of a freakin' kris; 26 inches long blade and 2 inches wide of serpentine fury:

Spunjer · 1st March 2011, 08:24 PM

Moar!!!!

A.alnakkas · 1st March 2011, 08:30 PM

I have no knowledge of these but this one is really beautiful !

Amuk Murugul · 1st March 2011, 09:54 PM

Hullo everybody,

A related thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...0940#post70940

Best,

Spunjer · 1st March 2011, 10:35 PM

Hi Amuk,
Thanks for the link. Yes, that's what i meant about the incised naga on the wide part of the blade. What i'm interested is if there are krises that has naga inlay similar to the ones closest to the sharp tip of the blade. I've only seen those type of inlays on barungs.

Battara · 1st March 2011, 11:49 PM

It is a wonderful piece and the silver inlay is amazing!

Great and unusual piece.

Maurice · 2nd March 2011, 12:02 AM

Hi Ron,

What's the purpose of the clamp here?
It looks very attractive, but I guess that's the only thing why it is there: as decoration?
So this probably is a "show off" piece or could it be ceremonial?

Maurice

mrwizard · 2nd March 2011, 12:13 AM

Very beautiful piece indeed

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maurice

What's the purpose of the clamp here?
It looks very attractive, but I guess that's the only thing why it is there: as decoration?
So this probably is a "show off" piece or could it be ceremonial?

From the photos it looks like the clamp is attached to a rivet going through the kris. So this would be not only be a very attractive but also a very functional clamp

Best Regards,
Thilo

Spunjer · 2nd March 2011, 12:17 AM

That's the baka-baka... instead of the gun trigger look-a-like type baka-baka, the panday decided to abbreviate the clamp and pinned it right thru the kris, which served the same purpose. I'm guessing it was done that way so it wouldn't interfere with the overall theme. You could say the pin itself are the naga's eyes. Pretty slick, huh? Oh, and the gangya's separated...

Spunjer · 2nd March 2011, 12:19 AM

Mrwizard beat me to it... dam this android phones.. or maybe i'm just a slow typer...

Amuk Murugul · 2nd March 2011, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

Hi Amuk,
Thanks for the link. Yes, that's what i meant about the incised naga on the wide part of the blade. What i'm interested is if there are krises that has naga inlay similar to the ones closest to the sharp tip of the blade. I've only seen those type of inlays on barungs.

Hullo Spunjer,

I'm not sure what you mean, but my kris has the naga inlay all along the blade, with its tail ending almost at the tip.

Best,

Rick · 2nd March 2011, 01:18 AM

Beautiful work !
What else can you say .

Dimasalang · 2nd March 2011, 01:25 AM

Wowowee! Thats just crazy!

Just when you think you seen them all... You guys never cease to amaze me!

Spunjer · 2nd March 2011, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amuk Murugul

Hullo Spunjer,

I'm not sure what you mean, but my kris has the naga inlay all along the blade, with its tail ending almost at the tip.

Best,

hi amuk,

it's this particular naga inlay i'm referring to:

i've never seen it on a kris before, although it's relatively common on barungs:

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=11110

the naga incised on the sorsoran (to borrow the keris terminology) of the above kris is somewhat similar to yours.

migueldiaz · 2nd March 2011, 08:24 AM

spunjer, you hit the jackpot partner!

thanks for posting the pics!!

Maurice · 2nd March 2011, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

That's the baka-baka... instead of the gun trigger look-a-like type baka-baka, the panday decided to abbreviate the clamp and pinned it right thru the kris, which served the same purpose. I'm guessing it was done that way so it wouldn't interfere with the overall theme. You could say the pin itself are the naga's eyes. Pretty slick, huh? Oh, and the gangya's separated...

Yes I notice the pin that goes through it now, when I'm looking at it on my laptop.
I didn't noticed it before on my cellphone.
Such pin however can't be as strong as the "normal" version of a baca-baca IMO, but very attractive this way.

Do you think this kind of handle is the original one to this great blade?

Great it has also a seperate gangya!

Spunjer · 2nd March 2011, 02:45 PM

@lorenz: always looking for that one of a kind

. yeah, pa swerte-swerte nga, noh?

@maurice: you know, i've been thinking about the hilt. when i first got it, i've thought about the hilt, if it was original or not. upon looking at my archival photos, i noticed on these type of krises (naga sorsoran), the handles are rather simple. you would think it should be junggayan or something. but looking at all the pics, it made sense; it's reverse of what we normally see. whereas some normal looking blades has very elaborate handles, these types IMHO utilizes plain handles so it doesn't take anything away from the blade. in other words, you could say it's all about the blades on these types. as far as stength i'd think this would be stronger, yes? whereas the majority just clamps, this one is riveted through.
the baka2x on this one blows me away! i just love how it follow the curves of the naga AND the indentation on the blade itself. i know this for sure; the baka2x on this one is original

love the fretwork as well. pretty cool stuff

migueldiaz · 2nd March 2011, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

@lorenz: always looking for that one of a kind

. yeah, pa swerte-swerte nga, noh?

you are one lucky son of a gun all right

with all those serpents, i'd say offhand that it is a maranaw kris. i mean just look at their houses (torogan), with the nagas all over those floor beam extensions (panolong).

would you say too that the kris really has maranaw traits? thanks.

Spunjer · 2nd March 2011, 04:39 PM

yeah, definitely maranao.
similarity on the panolong and the sorsoran:

it's uncanny. thanks for the pic, bro

Battara · 2nd March 2011, 06:33 PM

And it is definitely Maranao okir work. Even more beautiful up close.

CharlesS · 2nd March 2011, 09:20 PM

Great piece...looks like it might be a big 'un too.....

migueldiaz · 2nd March 2011, 11:17 PM

thanks, ron! since i'm not that familiar with the finer points of analyzing a kris, i have 'moar'

queries. based on the rendition of the 'jaw', can we also say that the kris indeed exhibits maranaw traits? attached is a guide which perhaps you yourself prepared for robert fulton? thanks again, bro

Sajen · 2nd March 2011, 11:38 PM

What a beautiful kris!

Love the baca-baca. Thank you very much for sharing.

Regards,

Detlef

kino · 3rd March 2011, 02:33 AM

SCORE!!!!
Really like that clamp design, very unusual, I 've never seen one like it.
Congrat-tuli-on, bay....

Spunjer · 3rd March 2011, 02:36 PM

you can still see the "jutting jaw"on this one, albeit not as pronounced. i notice this on the much later ones.

@ kino:
lagi, bay! just trying to catch up with you, holmes, lol...

Battara · 4th March 2011, 01:58 AM

Lorenz - nice post of these back to back and very accurate.

The only caveate is that when it comes to later pieces like Ron's, then things get fuzzier. Therefore one must go by other traits as well.

migueldiaz · 4th March 2011, 03:15 AM

Jose, thanks for the additional tips!

Sajen · 6th March 2011, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by migueldiaz

thanks, ron! since i'm not that familiar with the finer points of analyzing a kris, i have 'moar'

queries. based on the rendition of the 'jaw', can we also say that the kris indeed exhibits maranaw traits? attached is a guide which perhaps you yourself prepared for robert fulton? thanks again, bro

Thank you for posting this picture, I think it is very helpful not only for me!

Regards,

Detlef

migueldiaz · 6th March 2011, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

Thank you for posting this picture, I think it is very helpful not only for me!

Regards,

Detlef

Detlef, am happy to be of help somehow. Thanks, too and regards!

migueldiaz · 10th May 2011, 03:48 AM

Here's a similar piece, and it's a huge kris (another one is shown for comparison). The naga-themed kris has the following dimensions -- overall length: 28.9" and blade lt.: 24.6".

What's unusual about this naga kris is the guard is not separate from the blade. The only reason I can think of is that perhaps the maker did not want to have the separation line interfering with the deeply curving body of the naga near the hilt. Or can it be the other way around? That is, since the guard and the blade are integrated, then the naga can be placed as close as possible to the hilt.

In any case, in general what would be the latest thoughts of forumites on krises where the the guard and blades are not separate? Thanks in advance!

1st March 2011, 08:23 PM	#1
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Nice Kris i always wonder why naga symbols are found on barung and not on krises. yes, there are krises with naga incised on the wide part of the blade, but i haven't seen a talismanic symbol of the naga itself on the blade. i figure it's out there somewhere, and it's just a matter of time before i'd see pictures of it. well, what do you know? the moros of yore prolly heard my crazy conundrum, so lo and behold, they sent their redhead southern brethren from north carolina to deliver a kris so full of nagas that this baby must have been Medusa's sword: gentlemen, i introduce to you one heck of a freakin' kris; 26 inches long blade and 2 inches wide of serpentine fury: Last edited by Spunjer; 1st March 2011 at 08:34 PM.

2nd March 2011, 11:17 PM	#22
migueldiaz Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Manila, Phils. Posts: 1,042	thanks, ron! since i'm not that familiar with the finer points of analyzing a kris, i have 'moar' queries. based on the rendition of the 'jaw', can we also say that the kris indeed exhibits maranaw traits? attached is a guide which perhaps you yourself prepared for robert fulton? thanks again, bro Attached Images

10th May 2011, 03:48 AM	#30
migueldiaz Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Manila, Phils. Posts: 1,042	Here's a similar piece, and it's a huge kris (another one is shown for comparison). The naga-themed kris has the following dimensions -- overall length: 28.9" and blade lt.: 24.6". What's unusual about this naga kris is the guard is not separate from the blade. The only reason I can think of is that perhaps the maker did not want to have the separation line interfering with the deeply curving body of the naga near the hilt. Or can it be the other way around? That is, since the guard and the blade are integrated, then the naga can be placed as close as possible to the hilt. In any case, in general what would be the latest thoughts of forumites on krises where the the guard and blades are not separate? Thanks in advance! Attached Images

1st March 2011, 08:24 PM	#2
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Moar!!!!

1st March 2011, 08:30 PM	#3
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	I have no knowledge of these but this one is really beautiful !

1st March 2011, 09:54 PM	#4
Amuk Murugul Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Kaboejoetan Galoenggoeng Mélben Posts: 460	Hullo everybody, A related thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...0940#post70940 Best,

1st March 2011, 10:35 PM	#5
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Hi Amuk, Thanks for the link. Yes, that's what i meant about the incised naga on the wide part of the blade. What i'm interested is if there are krises that has naga inlay similar to the ones closest to the sharp tip of the blade. I've only seen those type of inlays on barungs.

1st March 2011, 11:49 PM	#6
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	It is a wonderful piece and the silver inlay is amazing! Great and unusual piece.

2nd March 2011, 12:02 AM	#7
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,352	Hi Ron, What's the purpose of the clamp here? It looks very attractive, but I guess that's the only thing why it is there: as decoration? So this probably is a "show off" piece or could it be ceremonial? Maurice

2nd March 2011, 12:17 AM	#9
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	That's the baka-baka... instead of the gun trigger look-a-like type baka-baka, the panday decided to abbreviate the clamp and pinned it right thru the kris, which served the same purpose. I'm guessing it was done that way so it wouldn't interfere with the overall theme. You could say the pin itself are the naga's eyes. Pretty slick, huh? Oh, and the gangya's separated...

2nd March 2011, 12:19 AM	#10
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Mrwizard beat me to it... dam this android phones.. or maybe i'm just a slow typer...

2nd March 2011, 01:18 AM	#12
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Beautiful work ! What else can you say .

2nd March 2011, 01:25 AM	#13
Dimasalang Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 264	Wowowee! Thats just crazy! Just when you think you seen them all... You guys never cease to amaze me!

2nd March 2011, 08:24 AM	#15
migueldiaz Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Manila, Phils. Posts: 1,042	spunjer, you hit the jackpot partner! thanks for posting the pics!!

2nd March 2011, 02:45 PM	#17
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	@lorenz: always looking for that one of a kind . yeah, pa swerte-swerte nga, noh? @maurice: you know, i've been thinking about the hilt. when i first got it, i've thought about the hilt, if it was original or not. upon looking at my archival photos, i noticed on these type of krises (naga sorsoran), the handles are rather simple. you would think it should be junggayan or something. but looking at all the pics, it made sense; it's reverse of what we normally see. whereas some normal looking blades has very elaborate handles, these types IMHO utilizes plain handles so it doesn't take anything away from the blade. in other words, you could say it's all about the blades on these types. as far as stength i'd think this would be stronger, yes? whereas the majority just clamps, this one is riveted through. the baka2x on this one blows me away! i just love how it follow the curves of the naga AND the indentation on the blade itself. i know this for sure; the baka2x on this one is original love the fretwork as well. pretty cool stuff

2nd March 2011, 04:39 PM	#19
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	yeah, definitely maranao. similarity on the panolong and the sorsoran: it's uncanny. thanks for the pic, bro

2nd March 2011, 06:33 PM	#20
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	And it is definitely Maranao okir work. Even more beautiful up close.

2nd March 2011, 09:20 PM	#21
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Great piece...looks like it might be a big 'un too.....

2nd March 2011, 11:38 PM	#23
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,788	What a beautiful kris! Love the baca-baca. Thank you very much for sharing. Regards, Detlef

3rd March 2011, 02:33 AM	#24
kino Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,005	SCORE!!!! Really like that clamp design, very unusual, I 've never seen one like it. Congrat-tuli-on, bay....

3rd March 2011, 02:36 PM	#25
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	you can still see the "jutting jaw"on this one, albeit not as pronounced. i notice this on the much later ones. @ kino: lagi, bay! just trying to catch up with you, holmes, lol...

4th March 2011, 01:58 AM	#26
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,226	Lorenz - nice post of these back to back and very accurate. The only caveate is that when it comes to later pieces like Ron's, then things get fuzzier. Therefore one must go by other traits as well.

4th March 2011, 03:15 AM	#27
migueldiaz Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Manila, Phils. Posts: 1,042	Jose, thanks for the additional tips!