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Panton · 10th February 2006, 01:33 PM

Greetings all,

I came across this forum a few weeks ago and have used your expert knowledge almost addictively since then to shed some light on the blades that I have indiscriminately accumulated over the years.
By the high standards of the forum, most of my "collection" would qualify as interesting junk at the most but each piece is dear to me nevertheless.
If I may, I will eventually have them checked by you all.

A few days ago I rescued a few keris.
I have never actually liked or handled a keris before, I prefer blades that can be used combatively and the keris (sauf les moro) always seemed more of a ritual item.
But these guys, although they are in a sorry state, exuded a kind of presence that made me buy them just to give them a decent home.
No scabbards, unforunately.
They seem to be rather small, the longest one being 45cm the smallest a mere 32cm (strange, broad blade at that)

All the hilts are loose, the spacers between blade and hilts are either missing or wrong/ill fitting...
No.3 has got an interesting, very distinctive repetitive pattern which is what I would assume to be some kind of pamor...could be wrong.
From what I learned by using the search function they seem to be from Java and at least turn of the century (19th to 20th)

I gather that it is improper to display a keris without a scabbard but since these do not have them, would it be bad taste to mount them together on a nice hardwood board?

What should be done with them? Clean, etch, scrap.....?
I would be grateful for some expert opinion.

For now, here they are in all their sorry splendour:

nechesh · 10th February 2006, 02:41 PM

Hi Panton, welcome to the forum. Well, i find each of these keris to be interesting in their own right and certainly worthy of collection. The short broad blade is an example of an early buda style keris sometimes called keris picit, though yours is not an ancient one it still appears to have good age and some interesting talismanic markings. The indentations along the blade are supposedly placed there by the empus fingertips while the blade is still hot.

They all need a good cleaning and restaining and the spacers (mendaks) are easy enough to replace. Depending upon where you live having sheath made for them will be your hardest task. Thanks for giving them a home.

Panton · 10th February 2006, 03:43 PM

hi nechesh,

thank you very much for you remarks...

looking at the keris what you say makes ergonomic sense because on each indention on the blade a concave corresponds to a convex, fitting my fingers perfectly.....he would have dented the blade four times..

...although, having spent a day in a forge a couple of weeks ago, I marvel at the pain-resistance of the man.
How that is done is quite beyond me, I came away with multiple burns and blood-blisters even without trying to put my fingerprints on the blade.
I attach the resulting blade at the bottom.

The Mendaks I would like to replace though, are they avaliable?
Where do you see talismanic markings?

As I doubt I would go to the length of having scabbards made, would a simple mounting be frowned upon by afficionados or do the keris injustice??

Thanks again for the guidance

Dirk

Rick · 10th February 2006, 06:23 PM

You have a PM .

nechesh · 10th February 2006, 11:33 PM

To answer your last question first, yes, some would say that it might be considered an "injustice" of sorts to leave a keris without a keris. A keris is generally not considered complete without one. Some would say that the sheath acts as a container for the keris' power and that power will leave an unattended keris. Some would say that the sheath acts as the feminine quality to the male quality of the blade (wilah) and that without it there is no completion. Does this mean that you need to have sheaths comissioned for these blades? Not necessarily, but that all depends on how you choose to relate to these weapons and how much weight you give to their spiritual nature.

I suspect that the mark on the keris picit that looks like a backwards 3 may well be an intentional talismanic symbol, though it could just be a trick of the light.
And yes, nice quality mendaks are readily available. I will PM you a source, though i suspect that is exactly the same info that Rick has already PMed to you.

10th February 2006, 01:33 PM	#1
Panton Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 3	new member Greetings all, I came across this forum a few weeks ago and have used your expert knowledge almost addictively since then to shed some light on the blades that I have indiscriminately accumulated over the years. By the high standards of the forum, most of my "collection" would qualify as interesting junk at the most but each piece is dear to me nevertheless. If I may, I will eventually have them checked by you all. A few days ago I rescued a few keris. I have never actually liked or handled a keris before, I prefer blades that can be used combatively and the keris (sauf les moro) always seemed more of a ritual item. But these guys, although they are in a sorry state, exuded a kind of presence that made me buy them just to give them a decent home. No scabbards, unforunately. They seem to be rather small, the longest one being 45cm the smallest a mere 32cm (strange, broad blade at that) All the hilts are loose, the spacers between blade and hilts are either missing or wrong/ill fitting... No.3 has got an interesting, very distinctive repetitive pattern which is what I would assume to be some kind of pamor...could be wrong. From what I learned by using the search function they seem to be from Java and at least turn of the century (19th to 20th) I gather that it is improper to display a keris without a scabbard but since these do not have them, would it be bad taste to mount them together on a nice hardwood board? What should be done with them? Clean, etch, scrap.....? I would be grateful for some expert opinion. For now, here they are in all their sorry splendour: Attached Images

10th February 2006, 03:43 PM	#3
Panton Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 3	new member hi nechesh, thank you very much for you remarks... looking at the keris what you say makes ergonomic sense because on each indention on the blade a concave corresponds to a convex, fitting my fingers perfectly.....he would have dented the blade four times.. ...although, having spent a day in a forge a couple of weeks ago, I marvel at the pain-resistance of the man. How that is done is quite beyond me, I came away with multiple burns and blood-blisters even without trying to put my fingerprints on the blade. I attach the resulting blade at the bottom. The Mendaks I would like to replace though, are they avaliable? Where do you see talismanic markings? As I doubt I would go to the length of having scabbards made, would a simple mounting be frowned upon by afficionados or do the keris injustice?? Thanks again for the guidance Dirk Attached Images

10th February 2006, 06:23 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Panton You have a PM .

10th February 2006, 02:41 PM	#2
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Hi Panton, welcome to the forum. Well, i find each of these keris to be interesting in their own right and certainly worthy of collection. The short broad blade is an example of an early buda style keris sometimes called keris picit, though yours is not an ancient one it still appears to have good age and some interesting talismanic markings. The indentations along the blade are supposedly placed there by the empus fingertips while the blade is still hot. They all need a good cleaning and restaining and the spacers (mendaks) are easy enough to replace. Depending upon where you live having sheath made for them will be your hardest task. Thanks for giving them a home.

10th February 2006, 11:33 PM	#5
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	To answer your last question first, yes, some would say that it might be considered an "injustice" of sorts to leave a keris without a keris. A keris is generally not considered complete without one. Some would say that the sheath acts as a container for the keris' power and that power will leave an unattended keris. Some would say that the sheath acts as the feminine quality to the male quality of the blade (wilah) and that without it there is no completion. Does this mean that you need to have sheaths comissioned for these blades? Not necessarily, but that all depends on how you choose to relate to these weapons and how much weight you give to their spiritual nature. I suspect that the mark on the keris picit that looks like a backwards 3 may well be an intentional talismanic symbol, though it could just be a trick of the light. And yes, nice quality mendaks are readily available. I will PM you a source, though i suspect that is exactly the same info that Rick has already PMed to you.