Help with identification

[Pertinax]

Приветствую всех участников форума. Я не являюсь специалистом по керисам, но в моей коллекции есть один экземпляр. Знаю, что керис с Суматры, рукоять типа Jawa Demam.
Хотелось бы узнать больше знать об этом керисе. Буду рад любой информации, заранее спасибо.

Greetings to all forum participants. I am not an expert on keris, but I have one in my collection. I know that keris is from Sumatra, the handle is like Jawa Demam.
I would like to know more about this keris. I would be glad for any information, thanks in advance.

[Pertinax]

More photos

[David]

Nice keris. I believe you are correct to place this in Sumatra, but exactly where i will leave for others. I would call this an "old" keris in that it seems to be pre-WWII, but i don't think it is extremely old. Perhaps 19th century, though the dress may be a little later.
I would say this keris blade is of the Bahari type. This type has two larger brothers, keris anak alang and keris penyalang or panjang.
You can read more about these classifications here:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=bahari
Over all a nice and attractive ensemble.

[Sajen]

Very nice keris, I agree with everything David has stated. It's a Minangkabau keris.

Regards,
Detlef

[kai]

I'm with Detlef - the fittings seem to suggest Minang usage. Minang Kabau culture is quite heterogeneous and there are also a lot of expat communities with long histories (including considerable fractions in Malaysia): Unless one is able to assign the correct subgroup with reasonable likelihood, one just doesn't know enough (like me...).

This piece doesn't come from the highlands around Kota Gede; so, quite likely a lowland group.

The apparently genuine Bangkinang-type blade doesn't help since these got traded widely. Its proportions appear to be a bit weird - it may have been shortened, I believe.

Regards,
Kai

[Pertinax]

Thanks to David, Detlef Kai for valuable and very useful information.
Some experts suggested that the object was from the Palembang region.
Regards, Yuri

[David]

Originally Posted by Pertinax

Some experts suggested that the object was from the Palembang region.

I believe that anyone who suggested to you that this was from Palembang should be immediately taken off your "expert" list.
I do understand Kai's suspicion about the blade being shortened. It's length does seem proportionately abrupt. But closer examination of the tip makes this less clear to me. You might be able to tell more if the blade was cleaned and stained and a pamor was revealed.

[kai]

Hello David,

I believe that anyone who suggested to you that this was from Palembang should be immediately taken off your "expert" list.

D'accord.

I do understand Kai's suspicion about the blade being shortened. It's length does seem proportionately abrupt. But closer examination of the tip makes this less clear to me. You might be able to tell more if the blade was cleaned and stained and a pamor was revealed.

The laminations won't tell if the blade was shortened.

The fullers seem to run off into the tip; this could be from shortening. It could also be original - if so, I'd expect it to be more distinct though (the blade is otherwise in fine condition and not worn much.

Regards,
Kai

[Pertinax]

Originally Posted by David

I believe that anyone who suggested to you that this was from Palembang should be immediately taken off your "expert" list.
I do understand Kai's suspicion about the blade being shortened. It's length does seem proportionately abrupt. But closer examination of the tip makes this less clear to me. You might be able to tell more if the blade was cleaned and stained and a pamor was revealed.

Большое спасибо David за информацию.
Экспертов «увольнять» не будем, все мы люди, а людям свойственно ошибаться. Все мы учимся, для этого и собираемся на форумах что бы узнать что-то новое, обменяться знаниями, опытом и информацией.
Сделал дополнительные фотографии лезвия. На лезвии – следы коррозии, грязи нет. У меня нет опыта обращения с керисами. Подскажите пожалуйста, нужно ли полировать лезвие или оставить как есть? Заранее спасибо.
С уважением Юрий

Many thanks to David for the information.
We will not “fire” experts, we are all human, and people tend to make mistakes. We all learn, and that’s why we gather on forums to learn something new, exchange knowledge, experience and information.
Took additional photos of the blade. There are traces of corrosion on the blade, no dirt. I have no experience with keris. Please tell me whether I need to polish the blade or leave it as is? Thank you in advance.
Regards, Yuri

[David]

Originally Posted by Pertinax

Many thanks to David for the information.
We will not “fire” experts, we are all human, and people tend to make mistakes. We all learn, and that’s why we gather on forums to learn something new, exchange knowledge, experience and information.
Took additional photos of the blade. There are traces of corrosion on the blade, no dirt. I have no experience with keris. Please tell me whether I need to polish the blade or leave it as is? Thank you in advance.

No Yuri, you definitely should not polish this blade. That would never be done with this type of blade.
Regarding your "expert", i did not suggest that you "fire" them. I simply suggested you should remove them from your list of keris experts, not ostracize them from your community. LOL!
While i certainly agree that we are all human and here to learn, no one who is truly an "expert" in the keris world would have mistaken the origins of this keris as Palembang. Both the dress and blade of Palembang keris are clearly very different from this one and easy to recognize...for an "expert". And it is you who is here on this forum learning, not the person who presented themself to you as an "expert".

[Pertinax]

Благодарю всех, кто принял участие в обсуждении и помог в идентификации кериса.
С уважением, Юрий

I thank everyone who took part in the discussion and helped in identifying the keris.
Regards, Yuri