How to carry a sword on a horse

Kubur · 9th December 2018, 10:37 PM

Hi Guys

I wanted to share with you these amazing photos.
What a strange way to me to carry a sword...

Kubur

Ian · 10th December 2018, 09:37 AM

Hi Kubur:

Rather odd way to carry their sword, as you say. These guys and their horses are definitely dressed up for something special, and one of the pics shows a bunch of mounted soldiers in the background plus a lot of flags. I suspect they are in their parade finery, which may have something to do with how the swords are being carried.

Ian.

mahratt · 10th December 2018, 09:48 AM

Lithographs of the late 19th century

David R · 10th December 2018, 09:04 PM

Back slung swords turn up all the time, and having the hilt down is quite common. Japanese prints show this a lot... but it demands a well fitted scabbard or a locking method.

David · 10th December 2018, 09:13 PM

Well, i'd say that given both the photographs and the 19th century prints it seems fairly confirmed that this is an accepted and traditional method of carry. I would think that it would be far easier to extract the blade from the scabbard in this position rather than over the shoulder and as David points out, this would work just fine as long as there was a method in place to prevent the sword from dropping out on its own. Very interesting!

kronckew · 11th December 2018, 11:48 AM

I've posted a couple photos of paintings, etc on this as well as a video of a moroccan sport, Tbourida, or the Fantasia, where teams , brightly dressed with swords on their backs, hilt down, charge and in unison discharge their muskets as close together as they can. Still happens now.

Here's another video or two:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27PEwSRgvD0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGhmEoisQEI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NV1q8OkgAE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SBSx4BKd1g

Swords clearly shown hilt down on left sides of riders.

It's a lot easier to draw from there as opposed to hilt up. how they do not fall out other than friction, I do not know.

ariel · 11th December 2018, 12:54 PM

I guess they have enough time to do it. Swords are not drawn seconds before the contact with the opponent.
But... they hold their muskets in the right hand. Presumably, they discharge them before they draw their sword also with the right hand. So, where does the musket go after the discharge?

I experimented with 4 nimchas: can unequivocally confirm that drawing is about as comfortable as the traditional one. Additional advantage of it is that the sharp edge always points back, so cutting off horse’s ears is less likely ( a big problem with Cossack sabers, specifically mentioned by contemporaneous authors and by the official regulation books. Have no idea how the rest of the world manage to avoid it:-)))

kronckew · 11th December 2018, 01:19 PM

Musket scabbard right side?

(I was going to say 'Fernando's Armoury

)

ariel · 11th December 2018, 01:42 PM

That’s a cop out:-) I just cannot see any musket scabbards, and they must be very long and visible.

kronckew · 11th December 2018, 01:44 PM

No, that'd be where they went in a real battle, hads are OK for the fantasia. Or slung over the other shoulder. Also a scabbard doesn't need to enclose the whole musket.

9th December 2018, 10:37 PM	#1
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	How to carry a sword on a horse Hi Guys I wanted to share with you these amazing photos. What a strange way to me to carry a sword... Kubur Attached Images

10th December 2018, 09:48 AM	#3
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	Lithographs of the late 19th century Attached Images

11th December 2018, 11:48 AM	#6
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,184	I've posted a couple photos of paintings, etc on this as well as a video of a moroccan sport, Tbourida, or the Fantasia, where teams , brightly dressed with swords on their backs, hilt down, charge and in unison discharge their muskets as close together as they can. Still happens now. Here's another video or two: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27PEwSRgvD0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGhmEoisQEI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NV1q8OkgAE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SBSx4BKd1g Swords clearly shown hilt down on left sides of riders. It's a lot easier to draw from there as opposed to hilt up. how they do not fall out other than friction, I do not know. Last edited by kronckew; 11th December 2018 at 12:14 PM.

11th December 2018, 12:54 PM	#7
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I guess they have enough time to do it. Swords are not drawn seconds before the contact with the opponent. But... they hold their muskets in the right hand. Presumably, they discharge them before they draw their sword also with the right hand. So, where does the musket go after the discharge? I experimented with 4 nimchas: can unequivocally confirm that drawing is about as comfortable as the traditional one. Additional advantage of it is that the sharp edge always points back, so cutting off horse’s ears is less likely ( a big problem with Cossack sabers, specifically mentioned by contemporaneous authors and by the official regulation books. Have no idea how the rest of the world manage to avoid it:-))) Last edited by ariel; 11th December 2018 at 01:39 PM.

10th December 2018, 09:37 AM	#2
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,204	Hi Kubur: Rather odd way to carry their sword, as you say. These guys and their horses are definitely dressed up for something special, and one of the pics shows a bunch of mounted soldiers in the background plus a lot of flags. I suspect they are in their parade finery, which may have something to do with how the swords are being carried. Ian.

10th December 2018, 09:04 PM	#4
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,079	Back slung swords turn up all the time, and having the hilt down is quite common. Japanese prints show this a lot... but it demands a well fitted scabbard or a locking method.

10th December 2018, 09:13 PM	#5
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,127	Well, i'd say that given both the photographs and the 19th century prints it seems fairly confirmed that this is an accepted and traditional method of carry. I would think that it would be far easier to extract the blade from the scabbard in this position rather than over the shoulder and as David points out, this would work just fine as long as there was a method in place to prevent the sword from dropping out on its own. Very interesting!

11th December 2018, 01:19 PM	#8
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,184	Musket scabbard right side? (I was going to say 'Fernando's Armoury )

11th December 2018, 01:42 PM	#9
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	That’s a cop out:-) I just cannot see any musket scabbards, and they must be very long and visible.

11th December 2018, 01:44 PM	#10
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,184	No, that'd be where they went in a real battle, hads are OK for the fantasia. Or slung over the other shoulder. Also a scabbard doesn't need to enclose the whole musket.