Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Ethnographic Weapons
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 1st March 2011, 07:23 PM   #1
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default Nice Kris

i always wonder why naga symbols are found on barung and not on krises. yes, there are krises with naga incised on the wide part of the blade, but i haven't seen a talismanic symbol of the naga itself on the blade. i figure it's out there somewhere, and it's just a matter of time before i'd see pictures of it. well, what do you know? the moros of yore prolly heard my crazy conundrum, so lo and behold, they sent their redhead southern brethren from north carolina to deliver a kris so full of nagas that this baby must have been Medusa's sword:
gentlemen, i introduce to you one heck of a freakin' kris; 26 inches long blade and 2 inches wide of serpentine fury:




Last edited by Spunjer; 1st March 2011 at 07:34 PM.
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 07:24 PM   #2
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

Moar!!!!







Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 07:30 PM   #3
A.alnakkas
Member
 
A.alnakkas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Kuwait
Posts: 1,340
Default

I have no knowledge of these but this one is really beautiful !
A.alnakkas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 08:54 PM   #4
Amuk Murugul
Member
 
Amuk Murugul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kaboejoetan Galoenggoeng Mélben
Posts: 460
Default

Hullo everybody,

A related thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...0940#post70940

Best,
Amuk Murugul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 09:35 PM   #5
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

Hi Amuk,
Thanks for the link. Yes, that's what i meant about the incised naga on the wide part of the blade. What i'm interested is if there are krises that has naga inlay similar to the ones closest to the sharp tip of the blade. I've only seen those type of inlays on barungs.
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 10:49 PM   #6
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,217
Default

It is a wonderful piece and the silver inlay is amazing!

Great and unusual piece.
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 11:02 PM   #7
Maurice
Member
 
Maurice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,334
Default

Hi Ron,

What's the purpose of the clamp here?
It looks very attractive, but I guess that's the only thing why it is there: as decoration?
So this probably is a "show off" piece or could it be ceremonial?

Maurice
Maurice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 11:13 PM   #8
mrwizard
Member
 
mrwizard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Dortmund, Germany
Posts: 102
Default

Very beautiful piece indeed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maurice
What's the purpose of the clamp here?
It looks very attractive, but I guess that's the only thing why it is there: as decoration?
So this probably is a "show off" piece or could it be ceremonial?
From the photos it looks like the clamp is attached to a rivet going through the kris. So this would be not only be a very attractive but also a very functional clamp

Best Regards,
Thilo
mrwizard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 11:17 PM   #9
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Post

That's the baka-baka... instead of the gun trigger look-a-like type baka-baka, the panday decided to abbreviate the clamp and pinned it right thru the kris, which served the same purpose. I'm guessing it was done that way so it wouldn't interfere with the overall theme. You could say the pin itself are the naga's eyes. Pretty slick, huh? Oh, and the gangya's separated...
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 11:19 PM   #10
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

Mrwizard beat me to it... dam this android phones.. or maybe i'm just a slow typer...
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2011, 11:41 PM   #11
Amuk Murugul
Member
 
Amuk Murugul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kaboejoetan Galoenggoeng Mélben
Posts: 460
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spunjer
Hi Amuk,
Thanks for the link. Yes, that's what i meant about the incised naga on the wide part of the blade. What i'm interested is if there are krises that has naga inlay similar to the ones closest to the sharp tip of the blade. I've only seen those type of inlays on barungs.
Hullo Spunjer,

I'm not sure what you mean, but my kris has the naga inlay all along the blade, with its tail ending almost at the tip.

Best,
Amuk Murugul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 12:18 AM   #12
Rick
Vikingsword Staff
 
Rick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,290
Thumbs up

Beautiful work !
What else can you say .
Rick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 12:25 AM   #13
Dimasalang
Member
 
Dimasalang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 264
Default

Wowowee! Thats just crazy!
Just when you think you seen them all... You guys never cease to amaze me!
Dimasalang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 05:42 AM   #14
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amuk Murugul
Hullo Spunjer,

I'm not sure what you mean, but my kris has the naga inlay all along the blade, with its tail ending almost at the tip.

Best,
hi amuk,

it's this particular naga inlay i'm referring to:



i've never seen it on a kris before, although it's relatively common on barungs:

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=11110

the naga incised on the sorsoran (to borrow the keris terminology) of the above kris is somewhat similar to yours.
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 07:24 AM   #15
migueldiaz
Member
 
migueldiaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Manila, Phils.
Posts: 1,042
Default

spunjer, you hit the jackpot partner! thanks for posting the pics!!
migueldiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 07:30 AM   #16
Maurice
Member
 
Maurice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spunjer
That's the baka-baka... instead of the gun trigger look-a-like type baka-baka, the panday decided to abbreviate the clamp and pinned it right thru the kris, which served the same purpose. I'm guessing it was done that way so it wouldn't interfere with the overall theme. You could say the pin itself are the naga's eyes. Pretty slick, huh? Oh, and the gangya's separated...
Yes I notice the pin that goes through it now, when I'm looking at it on my laptop.
I didn't noticed it before on my cellphone.
Such pin however can't be as strong as the "normal" version of a baca-baca IMO, but very attractive this way.

Do you think this kind of handle is the original one to this great blade?

Great it has also a seperate gangya!
Maurice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 01:45 PM   #17
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

@lorenz: always looking for that one of a kind . yeah, pa swerte-swerte nga, noh?

@maurice: you know, i've been thinking about the hilt. when i first got it, i've thought about the hilt, if it was original or not. upon looking at my archival photos, i noticed on these type of krises (naga sorsoran), the handles are rather simple. you would think it should be junggayan or something. but looking at all the pics, it made sense; it's reverse of what we normally see. whereas some normal looking blades has very elaborate handles, these types IMHO utilizes plain handles so it doesn't take anything away from the blade. in other words, you could say it's all about the blades on these types. as far as stength i'd think this would be stronger, yes? whereas the majority just clamps, this one is riveted through.
the baka2x on this one blows me away! i just love how it follow the curves of the naga AND the indentation on the blade itself. i know this for sure; the baka2x on this one is original
love the fretwork as well. pretty cool stuff
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 02:39 PM   #18
migueldiaz
Member
 
migueldiaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Manila, Phils.
Posts: 1,042
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spunjer
@lorenz: always looking for that one of a kind . yeah, pa swerte-swerte nga, noh?
you are one lucky son of a gun all right

with all those serpents, i'd say offhand that it is a maranaw kris. i mean just look at their houses (torogan), with the nagas all over those floor beam extensions (panolong).

would you say too that the kris really has maranaw traits? thanks.
Attached Images
  
migueldiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 03:39 PM   #19
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

yeah, definitely maranao.
similarity on the panolong and the sorsoran:


it's uncanny. thanks for the pic, bro
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 05:33 PM   #20
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,217
Default

And it is definitely Maranao okir work. Even more beautiful up close.
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 08:20 PM   #21
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,857
Default

Great piece...looks like it might be a big 'un too.....
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 10:17 PM   #22
migueldiaz
Member
 
migueldiaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Manila, Phils.
Posts: 1,042
Default

thanks, ron! since i'm not that familiar with the finer points of analyzing a kris, i have 'moar' queries. based on the rendition of the 'jaw', can we also say that the kris indeed exhibits maranaw traits? attached is a guide which perhaps you yourself prepared for robert fulton? thanks again, bro
Attached Images
 
migueldiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2011, 10:38 PM   #23
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,761
Default

What a beautiful kris! Love the baca-baca. Thank you very much for sharing.

Regards,

Detlef
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2011, 01:33 AM   #24
kino
Member
 
kino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,001
Default

SCORE!!!!
Really like that clamp design, very unusual, I 've never seen one like it.
Congrat-tuli-on, bay....
kino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2011, 01:36 PM   #25
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,730
Default

you can still see the "jutting jaw"on this one, albeit not as pronounced. i notice this on the much later ones.

@ kino:
lagi, bay! just trying to catch up with you, holmes, lol...
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th March 2011, 12:58 AM   #26
Battara
EAAF Staff
 
Battara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,217
Default

Lorenz - nice post of these back to back and very accurate.

The only caveate is that when it comes to later pieces like Ron's, then things get fuzzier. Therefore one must go by other traits as well.
Battara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th March 2011, 02:15 AM   #27
migueldiaz
Member
 
migueldiaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Manila, Phils.
Posts: 1,042
Default

Jose, thanks for the additional tips!
migueldiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 6th March 2011, 02:00 PM   #28
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,761
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by migueldiaz
thanks, ron! since i'm not that familiar with the finer points of analyzing a kris, i have 'moar' queries. based on the rendition of the 'jaw', can we also say that the kris indeed exhibits maranaw traits? attached is a guide which perhaps you yourself prepared for robert fulton? thanks again, bro

Thank you for posting this picture, I think it is very helpful not only for me!

Regards,

Detlef
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 6th March 2011, 02:02 PM   #29
migueldiaz
Member
 
migueldiaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Manila, Phils.
Posts: 1,042
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sajen
Thank you for posting this picture, I think it is very helpful not only for me!

Regards,

Detlef
Detlef, am happy to be of help somehow. Thanks, too and regards!
migueldiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th May 2011, 02:48 AM   #30
migueldiaz
Member
 
migueldiaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Manila, Phils.
Posts: 1,042
Default

Here's a similar piece, and it's a huge kris (another one is shown for comparison). The naga-themed kris has the following dimensions -- overall length: 28.9" and blade lt.: 24.6".

What's unusual about this naga kris is the guard is not separate from the blade. The only reason I can think of is that perhaps the maker did not want to have the separation line interfering with the deeply curving body of the naga near the hilt. Or can it be the other way around? That is, since the guard and the blade are integrated, then the naga can be placed as close as possible to the hilt.

In any case, in general what would be the latest thoughts of forumites on krises where the the guard and blades are not separate? Thanks in advance!
Attached Images
      
migueldiaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:56 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.