2-handed sword scabbards

[NeilUK]

Hi all, It seems that very few scabbards for 2-handed swords survive. I know of three in Scotland, some in Schloss Erbach in Germany and one in Solothurn, Switzerland. If you know of any others, and whether they were attached to a belt or not (if so how), please let me know.
Thanks, Neil

[David R]

Do you mean real two handed swords "Zweihänder", because for the most part they never had scabbards being carried and used more like a pole arm than a sword.

[NeilUK]

But my point, David, is that there were lots of them originally. The inventories of several German and Swiss arsenals refer to them in considerable numbers and even complain about those which are missing, and yes these references do apply to the late 16th century- early 17th "beidenhander", as they were called at the time. There are also illustrations of 2-handers being carried scabbarded in the Swiss chronicles, these are 15th-early 16th century, though. Belts are mentioned as well though it is not clear how they were worn or how the scabbards were attached to them.
Cheers, Neil

[Roland_M]

David is right, most of the "Zweihänder" had no scabbard.

The reason is imho simple, the scabbard is too big to carry, this means the scabbard would get lost in the first battle.


Roland

[NeilUK]

I agree that such scabbards would have been big and heavy, and easily lost and lots of engravings of Landsknechts show them carried or held with the blades bare; but how do we explain the repeated references to them in the inventories if they did not exist? The ones I mentioned in my first post I have seen either for real or in photographs.
Neil

[Timo Nieminen]

Scabbards deteriorate faster than swords. Somebody threw them out.

The only old surviving Japanese odachi scabbards I've seen are for temple swords, and I don't recall seeing a scabbard for a Ming chang dao. Yet, these had scabbards when they were used on the battlefield.

[David R]

Were these true "Zweihänder" or hand and a half "Bastard Swords". Either way one reason for their loss could be storing blades out of scabbards, which is a way of preventing them rusting into them immovably in long term storage. Another is them being discarded on the field, as is quite usual for a lot of swords.

[NeilUK]

Yes, I guess I'm not going to come across a great many and my curiosity will have to remain unsatisfied. But thanks everyone for your input.

[kronckew]

Originally Posted by Timo Nieminen

...I don't recall seeing a scabbard for a Ming chang dao. Yet, these had scabbards when they were used on the battlefield.

the miaodao, or changdao, were a two-handed anti-cavalry weapon, used by a special front line corps of larger men who used them to sever the horses legs of charging enemy cavalry. apparently also used up to & including ww2.

they had/have a wooden scabbard very similar to a std. chinese dao, suspended on a braided silk sling attached to a broad bronze sash hook & eye, which hooks over a sword sash belt much like a jeb stewart csa sword suspension (also used by yankees i hear). it suspends the sword at an angle somewhat like a long rapier would have been.

mine:

edited: added a curious chinese instructional cartoon showing how the chinese paired to sheath & unsheath their swords, or gingerly grabbed the spine below the guard to get it back in or out by one man. mine is not quite so long, but i can barely get it in & out on my own from the hook suspended slings. i tried it stuck in my sash like the drawing & couldn't draw the darn thing in the normal method. yiu do not want to get your fingers over the edge, the man is shown keeping them well away. i suspect the decorative bronze habaki-like blade cover on mine forward of the guard also serves to save your fingers should you need to use the lone person draw of fig. two. also i note they are shown with a crossbow casually stuffed in their sash at the back.

[Harry Marinakis]

Two-handed War swords of the 13th Century were carried on the hip in a scabbard, just like one-handed arming swords