Mystery Inscription on Controversial Sword

CharlesS · 25th January 2008, 01:42 AM

This sword has been attributed to Africa from Morocco to Ethiopia. Personally, I think photographic evidence strongly suggests Morocco, and I believe this form has already been the subject of a previous thread.

But, check out the inscription on this one. This example has the thickest, heaviest blade I have seen on one(though I have seen only 4), and I have never seen an inscription of this nature on anything.

One forumite has already suggested to me privately that it may have been a crude attempt to mimic a European inscription in a practically illiterate manner. I can understand that theory when you consider the prestige of European blades in much of that part of the world.

Any ideas??

TVV · 25th January 2008, 02:09 AM

Very nice sword! Here is a link to the Berber alphabet, just as an option to consider. To me, there is no resemblence, so most likely it is an imitation of text in Latin:

http://www.omniglot.com/writing/tifinagh.htm

Jim McDougall · 25th January 2008, 02:28 AM

Amazing Charles! Once again the mysterious 'Zanzibar sword' arises. This has been the topic of not only previous threads, but debates and the equally mysterious paper, written by me

in 2003 and presented in a talk at the Baltimore dinner. Mark, please help me out here OK, I do not have access to my notes or transcript of the paper.

Anyway, this particular sword came up in a double header fray during the Baltimore event with Tony Tirri who insisted these came from Ethiopia (the other was the notorious BSY which he claimed was from North Africa, and we have remained at odds it seems, ever since).

These have come up many times over the years, and typically I recount my findings which basically note that these 'Zanzibar' swords were captioned as such when Sir Richard Burton used the illustration and description from the earlier work published by Auguste Demmin. I confirmed this by finding a copy of the 1877 book and viewing the entry which called it a Zanzibar sword. Charles Buttin noted the error in his notes which were published in the catalog of his collections in 1933 (posthumously by his son). In that publication he illustrates these and termed it a s'boula, which I discussed with Dominique Buttin several times over several years. Since Charles lived in Morocco for decades, he was well aware of the weaponry there.

These curious H or I shaped hilts seem to have evolved indirectly from the European side arm known as the baselard, though direct evolution or development cannot be effectively supported by examples as far as is known. It does seem plausible that this form of weapon accompanied the many others that entered the North African littoral through trade over many years.

The Ethiopian attribution does have some basis in that there have been from one to several known examples from there (one appeared in a grouping of weapons in a monograph on African weapons many years ago). I addressed this in the paper also by suggesting that these probably came to Ethiopia across trans Saharan trade routes, where they probably entered the armouries of the Amharic rulers. The weapons for these rulers were provided by the Falashas, Jewish tribe in Ethiopia who were also known as blacksmiths there. I believe that there was contact between Jewish artisans in Morocco, who also furbished daggers and weapons and the Falasha, though this idea would need more research to be supported.

From this point, trade likely carried some of these s'boula to the key trade center of Zanzibar, where it seems likely the attribution may have derived.

In reviewing some of the previous threads over the past several years via search, there have been some most interesting examples and discussion brought in.

I agree with Teodor on his observation on the Berber alphabet, and just wanted to add the history lesson to support what you said on Morocco!

All best regards,
Jim

CharlesS · 25th January 2008, 04:05 AM

Thanks TVV and Jim.....I had not seen the Berber alphabet before, and I remember your paper and presentation Jim...actually have a copy of it, but no idea where at the moment. Could you email a copy??

The photo that has intrigues me can be found on Mr. Gasior's site Collectable Firearms and Edged Weapons under Oriental Rifles. It is a photo of a Moroccan man(definitely with a Moroccan rifle) and an identical sword tucked in his belt.

I am currently asking permission for use of the photo in this thread.

kahnjar1 · 25th January 2008, 04:16 AM

Check Tirri's book Islamic Weapons, Page 80, where he attributes this sword (and calls it a JIBOULA SHORT SWORD) originally to the Falashas or Falas Mora of Ethiopia. The accompanying pic however shows 2 of these swords "mounted in Morocco 19th Century". He quotes Pankhurst, A Social History of Ethiopia,Addis Ababa 1990

Jim McDougall · 25th January 2008, 05:15 AM

Thank you so much for remembering the presentation Charles, that was quite an event that evening. I dont have a copy right now to send you, but I hope to gain access to my material soon, and I will be delighted to get you a copy. I am very interested in seeing the photo you note from the Gasior site, which sounds as if it further supports the Moroccan attribution. There seems to have been a certain degree of variation in these s'boula as further discussed in Buttin's "Les Poignards et les Sabres Morocains" ("Hesperis, Tome XXVI, 1939), if I recall correctly, however the hilt as seen here is shown in the 1933 reference, and again as Moroccan.

Kahnjar1, I appreciate your citing the Tirri reference, and I must say that Mr. Tirri did convincingly support the example he held that evening was of course from Ethiopia. His notes accompanying the illustrations (and Moroccan provenance) would of course support the suggestion I made in 2003 that there may have been a connection via Saharan trade between the Jewish artisans in Morocco and the Falashas in Ethiopia, accounting for the presence of a number of these in Ethiopia.
Interestingly, the same premise occurred somewhat that same evening with the suggestion that the Black Sea Yataghan was actually North African, based on an example with some decidedly North African characteristics. This contention was outweighed by the preponderance of these swords that had presence throughout Transcaucasian and Turkish regions.

These are definitely fascinating ethnographic weapons, and even more so is that they carry such interesting history reflecting the dynamics of diffusion via the vast trade, cultural and intertribal networks.

All very best regards,
Jim

fernando · 25th January 2008, 07:36 PM

Amazing thing

If you invert (mirror) one of the images, you will find that some "characters" look alike

.

CharlesS · 27th January 2008, 01:41 PM

Here is the photo I had mentioned earlier. The rifle and, indeed, the architecture(door style) argue strongly that this is a Moroccan.

Jim McDougall · 27th January 2008, 10:49 PM

Thank you very much for posting that Charles. Excellent photo, and I wish I would have had it when I wrote on the "Zanzibar Sword" in 2003!

All best regards,
Jim

josh stout · 30th January 2008, 04:40 PM

I know nothing on this subject, but a quick look at "Ancient Berber (vertical)" (http://www.omniglot.com/writing/berber.htm) looks much more likely than an example of Ethiopian script (http://www.ancientscripts.com/ethiopic.html). I also tried Coptic just for fun, but that just looks like Greek.
Josh

CharlesS · 8th June 2014, 11:43 PM

Is there any agreement on an actual name for this sword???

Jim McDougall · 9th June 2014, 05:31 AM

As far as I have understood, as indicated in post #6 with the references attributed to Charles Buttin, I would regard this to be a Moroccan sboula. As discussed over the years, the Burton reference has classified this as a 'Zanzibar' sword along with the familiar Omani kattara with cylindrical hilt. However the Buttin reference is most reliable and he cites Burton's error in perpetuating the Demmin (1877) reference .
The reason these ended up with Ethiopian association is that an apparent number of these were among weapons shown in the pamphlet "Weapons of Africa" as well as there are examples with Amharic 'geez' script. These are most likely to have arrived there via trade networks.

As always, there is probably no 'agreement' on proper term or attribution but this is my perception over the past 10 or 12 years.

25th January 2008, 01:42 AM	#1
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Mystery Inscription on Controversial Sword This sword has been attributed to Africa from Morocco to Ethiopia. Personally, I think photographic evidence strongly suggests Morocco, and I believe this form has already been the subject of a previous thread. But, check out the inscription on this one. This example has the thickest, heaviest blade I have seen on one(though I have seen only 4), and I have never seen an inscription of this nature on *anything*. One forumite has already suggested to me privately that it may have been a crude attempt to mimic a European inscription in a practically illiterate manner. I can understand that theory when you consider the prestige of European blades in much of that part of the world. Any ideas?? Attached Images

25th January 2008, 02:28 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,951	Amazing Charles! Once again the mysterious 'Zanzibar sword' arises. This has been the topic of not only previous threads, but debates and the equally mysterious paper, written by me in 2003 and presented in a talk at the Baltimore dinner. Mark, please help me out here OK, I do not have access to my notes or transcript of the paper. Anyway, this particular sword came up in a double header fray during the Baltimore event with Tony Tirri who insisted these came from Ethiopia (the other was the notorious BSY which he claimed was from North Africa, and we have remained at odds it seems, ever since). These have come up many times over the years, and typically I recount my findings which basically note that these 'Zanzibar' swords were captioned as such when Sir Richard Burton used the illustration and description from the earlier work published by Auguste Demmin. I confirmed this by finding a copy of the 1877 book and viewing the entry which called it a Zanzibar sword. Charles Buttin noted the error in his notes which were published in the catalog of his collections in 1933 (posthumously by his son). In that publication he illustrates these and termed it a s'boula, which I discussed with Dominique Buttin several times over several years. Since Charles lived in Morocco for decades, he was well aware of the weaponry there. These curious H or I shaped hilts seem to have evolved indirectly from the European side arm known as the baselard, though direct evolution or development cannot be effectively supported by examples as far as is known. It does seem plausible that this form of weapon accompanied the many others that entered the North African littoral through trade over many years. The Ethiopian attribution does have some basis in that there have been from one to several known examples from there (one appeared in a grouping of weapons in a monograph on African weapons many years ago). I addressed this in the paper also by suggesting that these probably came to Ethiopia across trans Saharan trade routes, where they probably entered the armouries of the Amharic rulers. The weapons for these rulers were provided by the Falashas, Jewish tribe in Ethiopia who were also known as blacksmiths there. I believe that there was contact between Jewish artisans in Morocco, who also furbished daggers and weapons and the Falasha, though this idea would need more research to be supported. From this point, trade likely carried some of these s'boula to the key trade center of Zanzibar, where it seems likely the attribution may have derived. In reviewing some of the previous threads over the past several years via search, there have been some most interesting examples and discussion brought in. I agree with Teodor on his observation on the Berber alphabet, and just wanted to add the history lesson to support what you said on Morocco! All best regards, Jim Last edited by Jim McDougall; 25th January 2008 at 05:16 AM. Reason: wording

25th January 2008, 04:16 AM	#5
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,741	JIBOULA Check Tirri's book Islamic Weapons, Page 80, where he attributes this sword (and calls it a JIBOULA SHORT SWORD) originally to the Falashas or Falas Mora of Ethiopia. The accompanying pic however shows 2 of these swords "mounted in Morocco 19th Century". He quotes Pankhurst, A Social History of Ethiopia,Addis Ababa 1990

25th January 2008, 07:36 PM	#7
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Amazing thing If you invert (mirror) one of the images, you will find that some "characters" look alike . Attached Images

27th January 2008, 01:41 PM	#8
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Here is the photo I had mentioned earlier. The rifle and, indeed, the architecture(door style) argue strongly that this is a Moroccan. Attached Images Last edited by CharlesS; 27th January 2008 at 01:57 PM.

25th January 2008, 02:09 AM	#2
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,625	Very nice sword! Here is a link to the Berber alphabet, just as an option to consider. To me, there is no resemblence, so most likely it is an imitation of text in Latin: http://www.omniglot.com/writing/tifinagh.htm

25th January 2008, 04:05 AM	#4
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Thanks TVV and Jim.....I had not seen the Berber alphabet before, and I remember your paper and presentation Jim...actually have a copy of it, but no idea where at the moment. Could you email a copy?? The photo that has intrigues me can be found on Mr. Gasior's site Collectable Firearms and Edged Weapons under Oriental Rifles. It is a photo of a Moroccan man(definitely with a Moroccan rifle) and an identical sword tucked in his belt. I am currently asking permission for use of the photo in this thread.

25th January 2008, 05:15 AM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,951	Thank you so much for remembering the presentation Charles, that was quite an event that evening. I dont have a copy right now to send you, but I hope to gain access to my material soon, and I will be delighted to get you a copy. I am very interested in seeing the photo you note from the Gasior site, which sounds as if it further supports the Moroccan attribution. There seems to have been a certain degree of variation in these s'boula as further discussed in Buttin's "Les Poignards et les Sabres Morocains" ("Hesperis, Tome XXVI, 1939), if I recall correctly, however the hilt as seen here is shown in the 1933 reference, and again as Moroccan. Kahnjar1, I appreciate your citing the Tirri reference, and I must say that Mr. Tirri did convincingly support the example he held that evening was of course from Ethiopia. His notes accompanying the illustrations (and Moroccan provenance) would of course support the suggestion I made in 2003 that there may have been a connection via Saharan trade between the Jewish artisans in Morocco and the Falashas in Ethiopia, accounting for the presence of a number of these in Ethiopia. Interestingly, the same premise occurred somewhat that same evening with the suggestion that the Black Sea Yataghan was actually North African, based on an example with some decidedly North African characteristics. This contention was outweighed by the preponderance of these swords that had presence throughout Transcaucasian and Turkish regions. These are definitely fascinating ethnographic weapons, and even more so is that they carry such interesting history reflecting the dynamics of diffusion via the vast trade, cultural and intertribal networks. All very best regards, Jim

27th January 2008, 10:49 PM	#9
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,951	Thank you very much for posting that Charles. Excellent photo, and I wish I would have had it when I wrote on the "Zanzibar Sword" in 2003! All best regards, Jim

30th January 2008, 04:40 PM	#10
josh stout Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 407	I know nothing on this subject, but a quick look at "Ancient Berber (vertical)" (http://www.omniglot.com/writing/berber.htm) looks much more likely than an example of Ethiopian script (http://www.ancientscripts.com/ethiopic.html). I also tried Coptic just for fun, but that just looks like Greek. Josh

8th June 2014, 11:43 PM	#11
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Is there any agreement on an actual name for this sword???

9th June 2014, 05:31 AM	#12
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,951	As far as I have understood, as indicated in post #6 with the references attributed to Charles Buttin, I would regard this to be a Moroccan sboula. As discussed over the years, the Burton reference has classified this as a 'Zanzibar' sword along with the familiar Omani kattara with cylindrical hilt. However the Buttin reference is most reliable and he cites Burton's error in perpetuating the Demmin (1877) reference . The reason these ended up with Ethiopian association is that an apparent number of these were among weapons shown in the pamphlet "Weapons of Africa" as well as there are examples with Amharic 'geez' script. These are most likely to have arrived there via trade networks. As always, there is probably no 'agreement' on proper term or attribution but this is my perception over the past 10 or 12 years.