Club info please

graeme gt · 23rd January 2010, 01:28 PM

Hi Guys,Can you help me out with this one its 4ft longwith greenish stone.

colin henshaw · 23rd January 2010, 01:42 PM

Hi Graeme

Its from New Guinea - the stone head would have been cemented to the shaft with "putty nut". Nice piece.

Regards

Freddy · 23rd January 2010, 01:54 PM

On the site of the Division of Antropology of the American Museum of Natural History (http://anthro.amnh.org/), I found some examples in the collection's database.

This type of club comes from New Britain and is called 'Palau'.

graeme gt · 23rd January 2010, 02:16 PM

Thanks Guys,Putty Nut you couldnt make it up.

Tim Simmons · 23rd January 2010, 10:02 PM

You lucky lucky chap. Not just PNG but other Islands. I believe that the stone ball heads are often held to the haft by dried clay, Atuna nut putty is an extreamly resilient substance and would still be evident. When clay is dry it would hold for most purposes at the time, think of sun dried mud bricks.

Tim Simmons · 8th August 2010, 08:34 PM

graeme you will find this interesting.
Piercing hole worked from both sdes. Held fast with barkcloth, easy to fall apart easy to replace. Probably why older ones like yours are always loose. Just get some tourist painted barkcloth and adapt? Pictures from 1936-7 {The Kukukuku of the Upper Watut, Beatrice Blackwood}. Sorry for such huge pictures but not much point in showing otherwise.

graeme gt · 9th August 2010, 12:31 PM

Great stuff Tim all i need from you now is how the Zulu wire work is done

Cheers

Tim Simmons · 29th November 2011, 07:17 PM

I now have one of these clubs. Sorry for the indoor pictures. I am thinking that there must be different regional models and possibly different fighting techniques of these clubs. I have seen these clubs with the stone head fixed with clay or other mastic. Also as illustrated in this thread, fixed with tapa cloth, but and most seen is this loose stone head. One can see that there is no trace of mastic of any kind. Just patination and some wear. I wonder if this is a two handed weapon to use the spike end. Held in general with the hands roughly the distance from the stone and the spike. Like this it would be possible to pick and swing at relativly close contact. The fact that the stone is not fixed is not a problem, the swing keeps the stone in place. The hands can easily be brought together at the spike end for the full distance swing of over 1m and arms length. Anyway I love it

Tim Simmons · 11th December 2011, 05:23 PM

graeme,

All the information we need about fixing the stone head is here.

http://vernon.qm.qld.gov.au:8080/sea...&highlight=13#

I doubt we could get any of the nut putty here. Would it be acceptable to make up an alternative black putty? Using wax+tree resin or shalac and charcoal dust ?

Finding this site made me look again with a x10 loop. On the inside of the stone a black residue can be found. Also small patches on the wood

fearn · 12th December 2011, 06:48 AM

Hi Tim,

I'd suggest that whatever you make for putty, you make it so that it's easy to dissolve later on.

Best,

F

junker · 12th December 2011, 06:07 PM

Hi,

that s life in its best.

This came to me three month ago here in germany, and i want to research about it in chrismas hollidays. And now here is a topic about it, great forum.

So, mine has no fixing at the stone.
I guess it is picked up around 1900 when the teritory was called Neupommern and was a german colony (1885-1914).

There were some more Spears and a bow with arrows coming with it. One bow an a club from afrika were named to pick up in Bagamayo in 1892. These african clup (knobkerrie) is the last photo here, the other items I will put in another tread.

Alle the best from germany

Dirk

Tim Simmons · 12th December 2011, 07:00 PM

Dirk thank you for joining.

I got mine from Germany as it happens. I am working my way round the German collections, this February is Hamburg. I will do Stuttgart as soon as thier usual ocanic display is back up. Here is a lot more information on the preperation and use of "Parinarium nut putty" these pages are from "An Ethnology of the Admiralty Islands, S. Ohnrmus, Hawaii university press" The last picture or the colour picture with the parinarium modeled bird is from "Admiralty Islands art from the south seas, museum rietberg zurich"

Just need some nuts.

junker · 12th December 2011, 07:13 PM

Hi Tim,

I am located in Berlin and there ist a big museum for ethnography. ( But there was no club like ours

). It will get a new location in 2017.

Hamburg was not so interesting, for thre was a renovation, when i visited it.

Leipzig, the grassi museum is great, for my opinion.

And Dresden is only a small part of the huge part open, only the asian part in the moment, but more than 80 % weapons. And there ist the Turkish Chamber as well in Dresden. This one is my favourite.

So a lot to see in germany, and i hope I can Visit some swiss museums sometime. This year I was in Coburg and Schloß Burgk for european weapons. Emden three years ago, and ...
So less time to see all

Dirk

Tim Simmons · 12th December 2011, 07:23 PM

I was in Berlin this year and I thought the Dalem was very good indeed. Really good stuff on display if you are into the Islands. I do not care so much for metal stuff, I work with it. Yes Switzerland has museums on the list and one more to visit in the Netherlands.

Tim Simmons · 13th April 2012, 03:52 PM

Noninvasive, reversable and hard solution to the problem of a loose head. The only clubs I have seen with the original putty have been in museum. All the examples in the market that my budget is anywhere near all have loose heads. Not anymore one could adjust the colour and texture if you felt the need to, rubbing in some ash+fine grit.

This link is most helpful. Helping one understand the diffusion of metal and metal tools in the South Seas and this is just whalers. You can understand how some places became centres. Some people not so lucky, not on native trade routes, would remain without metal metal.
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...YhzCWf_9Q3enng

Gavin Nugent · 13th April 2012, 04:38 PM

A nice tidy up Tim.

I do believe I have seen very small Cowrie like shell embedded in the 'putty' too, would be an easy addition with a little heat from the dryer.

Gav

Tim Simmons · 13th April 2012, 05:00 PM

Yes some are decorated with shells and feathers others are plain. If you have or can get shells you will have to stick them in while the mastic is still soft. It is a bake in the oven substance, 110c. First I tried high powered light bulb. Then hit on the wifes hair drier.

23rd January 2010, 01:28 PM	#1
graeme gt Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 97	Club info please Hi Guys,Can you help me out with this one its 4ft longwith greenish stone. Attached Images

23rd January 2010, 10:02 PM	#5
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	You lucky lucky chap. Not just PNG but other Islands. I believe that the stone ball heads are often held to the haft by dried clay, Atuna nut putty is an extreamly resilient substance and would still be evident. When clay is dry it would hold for most purposes at the time, think of sun dried mud bricks. Last edited by Tim Simmons; 23rd January 2010 at 10:22 PM.

8th August 2010, 08:34 PM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	graeme you will find this interesting. Piercing hole worked from both sdes. Held fast with barkcloth, easy to fall apart easy to replace. Probably why older ones like yours are always loose. Just get some tourist painted barkcloth and adapt? Pictures from 1936-7 {The Kukukuku of the Upper Watut, Beatrice Blackwood}. Sorry for such huge pictures but not much point in showing otherwise. Attached Images

29th November 2011, 07:17 PM	#8
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	I now have one of these clubs. Sorry for the indoor pictures. I am thinking that there must be different regional models and possibly different fighting techniques of these clubs. I have seen these clubs with the stone head fixed with clay or other mastic. Also as illustrated in this thread, fixed with tapa cloth, but and most seen is this loose stone head. One can see that there is no trace of mastic of any kind. Just patination and some wear. I wonder if this is a two handed weapon to use the spike end. Held in general with the hands roughly the distance from the stone and the spike. Like this it would be possible to pick and swing at relativly close contact. The fact that the stone is not fixed is not a problem, the swing keeps the stone in place. The hands can easily be brought together at the spike end for the full distance swing of over 1m and arms length. Anyway I love it Attached Images

12th December 2011, 06:07 PM	#11
junker Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 140	my club Hi, that s life in its best. This came to me three month ago here in germany, and i want to research about it in chrismas hollidays. And now here is a topic about it, great forum. So, mine has no fixing at the stone. I guess it is picked up around 1900 when the teritory was called Neupommern and was a german colony (1885-1914). There were some more Spears and a bow with arrows coming with it. One bow an a club from afrika were named to pick up in Bagamayo in 1892. These african clup (knobkerrie) is the last photo here, the other items I will put in another tread. Alle the best from germany Dirk Attached Images

23rd January 2010, 01:42 PM	#2
colin henshaw Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,430	Hi Graeme Its from New Guinea - the stone head would have been cemented to the shaft with "putty nut". Nice piece. Regards

23rd January 2010, 01:54 PM	#3
Freddy Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sint-Amandsberg (near Ghent, Belgium) Posts: 830	On the site of the Division of Antropology of the American Museum of Natural History (http://anthro.amnh.org/), I found some examples in the collection's database. This type of club comes from New Britain and is called 'Palau'.

23rd January 2010, 02:16 PM	#4
graeme gt Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 97	Thanks Guys,Putty Nut you couldnt make it up.

9th August 2010, 12:31 PM	#7
graeme gt Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 97	Great stuff Tim all i need from you now is how the Zulu wire work is done Cheers

11th December 2011, 05:23 PM	#9
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	graeme, All the information we need about fixing the stone head is here. http://vernon.qm.qld.gov.au:8080/sea...&highlight=13# I doubt we could get any of the nut putty here. Would it be acceptable to make up an alternative black putty? Using wax+tree resin or shalac and charcoal dust ? Finding this site made me look again with a x10 loop. On the inside of the stone a black residue can be found. Also small patches on the wood

12th December 2011, 06:48 AM	#10
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Hi Tim, I'd suggest that whatever you make for putty, you make it so that it's easy to dissolve later on. Best, F

12th December 2011, 07:00 PM	#12
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	Dirk thank you for joining. I got mine from Germany as it happens. I am working my way round the German collections, this February is Hamburg. I will do Stuttgart as soon as thier usual ocanic display is back up. Here is a lot more information on the preperation and use of "Parinarium nut putty" these pages are from "An Ethnology of the Admiralty Islands, S. Ohnrmus, Hawaii university press" The last picture or the colour picture with the parinarium modeled bird is from "Admiralty Islands art from the south seas, museum rietberg zurich" Just need some nuts. Attached Images

12th December 2011, 07:13 PM	#13
junker Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 140	museums germany Hi Tim, I am located in Berlin and there ist a big museum for ethnography. ( But there was no club like ours ). It will get a new location in 2017. Hamburg was not so interesting, for thre was a renovation, when i visited it. Leipzig, the grassi museum is great, for my opinion. And Dresden is only a small part of the huge part open, only the asian part in the moment, but more than 80 % weapons. And there ist the Turkish Chamber as well in Dresden. This one is my favourite. So a lot to see in germany, and i hope I can Visit some swiss museums sometime. This year I was in Coburg and Schloß Burgk for european weapons. Emden three years ago, and ... So less time to see all Dirk

12th December 2011, 07:23 PM	#14
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	I was in Berlin this year and I thought the Dalem was very good indeed. Really good stuff on display if you are into the Islands. I do not care so much for metal stuff, I work with it. Yes Switzerland has museums on the list and one more to visit in the Netherlands.

13th April 2012, 03:52 PM	#15
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	Noninvasive, reversable and hard solution to the problem of a loose head. The only clubs I have seen with the original putty have been in museum. All the examples in the market that my budget is anywhere near all have loose heads. Not anymore one could adjust the colour and texture if you felt the need to, rubbing in some ash+fine grit. This link is most helpful. Helping one understand the diffusion of metal and metal tools in the South Seas and this is just whalers. You can understand how some places became centres. Some people not so lucky, not on native trade routes, would remain without metal metal. https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...YhzCWf_9Q3enng Attached Images

13th April 2012, 04:38 PM	#16
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	A nice tidy up Tim. I do believe I have seen very small Cowrie like shell embedded in the 'putty' too, would be an easy addition with a little heat from the dryer. Gav

13th April 2012, 05:00 PM	#17
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	Yes some are decorated with shells and feathers others are plain. If you have or can get shells you will have to stick them in while the mastic is still soft. It is a bake in the oven substance, 110c. First I tried high powered light bulb. Then hit on the wifes hair drier.