Any info on this Barong?

apolaki · 26th August 2017, 04:27 AM

This is my first actual Barong! Actually holding one, I never knew they were so big & heavy. The Barong is about 23 inches long. Blade alone is 16 inches, Hilt is 7 inches. Sheath is approximately 17 inches but the Barong will not fit inside it whatsoever. Perhaps it's the wrong sheath for the weapon? I'm really interested to learn more about it if anyone cares to share based on what they can glean from the pictures, Thank you!

kronckew · 26th August 2017, 08:53 PM

nice one. rare to have the fancy bits on the grip intact, they get broken off frequently. they are beefy as well as very sharp and deadly. the sheath may have gotten mixed up with one from a slightly different barong. the sheaths were frequently dropped before a battle, to be recovered if they won, or remain un-needed if they didn't. could be a after battle pickup by a trooper who just grabbed one that was close. bldes are usually well made and may be laminated steel. some blades were even made in china. both countries had very good blade smiths.

there are anecdotes about the moro jurementado insurrectionists of the early 1900's high on pot attacking US troops with these and actually cutting one in half at the waist after being shot a few times with the 9mm (38 cal) issue revolver. one theory for the rise in demand for return to a .45 cal. weapon. sadly, the bean counters had struck and decided the .38 was cheaper, ammo was lighter and easier to carry. much like the current round of bean counters who always plan for the last war, not the current. i gather the private purchase of .45's amongst the US forces is fairly high now too. just like then.

those who do not learn from history, and who try to cover it up, will often be forced to repeat it.

i'm sure others more knowledgeable in this area will be happy to provide details regarding the more precise origins

Battara · 26th August 2017, 10:33 PM

This indeed a Sulu barong, in fact it probably belonged to a datu and is a working datu barong. Datu working barongs used for everyday work had the tail part and nose parts like this one. Those with these elaborations are called junggayan style, and you have a datu junggayan barong. Kronckew is right in that these were often broken off in later years.

The junggayan style of barong and kris is understood to be from the late 1800s. So I would guess that your piece is from the late 1800s to the early 20th century.

Now I am not surprised that a later owner tried to match a scabbard to this and thus the reason why they don't fit together. (It is also possible but less likely that the wood shrank so much that it won't wrap around the blade.) In fact your blade appears wider than the scabbard.

On the blade edge, the shape looks like it is beveled. If it is, this too is a little less common and is called a shadrigan blade.

Where the blade and the hilt meet, is that copper or brass?

Congratulations on a nice first piece!

CharlesS · 26th August 2017, 11:16 PM

Lovely example...congrats! Always so nice to see one of these with the pommel complete. It is obvious even from period photos that the lovely pommel carvings were frequently broken off.

Great get!

26th August 2017, 04:27 AM	#1
apolaki Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 160	Any info on this Barong? This is my first actual Barong! Actually holding one, I never knew they were so big & heavy. The Barong is about 23 inches long. Blade alone is 16 inches, Hilt is 7 inches. Sheath is approximately 17 inches but the Barong will not fit inside it whatsoever. Perhaps it's the wrong sheath for the weapon? I'm really interested to learn more about it if anyone cares to share based on what they can glean from the pictures, Thank you! Attached Images

26th August 2017, 08:53 PM	#2
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,184	nice one. rare to have the fancy bits on the grip intact, they get broken off frequently. they are beefy as well as very sharp and deadly. the sheath may have gotten mixed up with one from a slightly different barong. the sheaths were frequently dropped before a battle, to be recovered if they won, or remain un-needed if they didn't. could be a after battle pickup by a trooper who just grabbed one that was close. bldes are usually well made and may be laminated steel. some blades were even made in china. both countries had very good blade smiths. there are anecdotes about the moro jurementado insurrectionists of the early 1900's high on pot attacking US troops with these and actually cutting one in half at the waist after being shot a few times with the 9mm (38 cal) issue revolver. one theory for the rise in demand for return to a .45 cal. weapon. sadly, the bean counters had struck and decided the .38 was cheaper, ammo was lighter and easier to carry. much like the current round of bean counters who always plan for the last war, not the current. i gather the private purchase of .45's amongst the US forces is fairly high now too. just like then. those who do not learn from history, and who try to cover it up, will often be forced to repeat it. i'm sure others more knowledgeable in this area will be happy to provide details regarding the more precise origins Last edited by kronckew; 26th August 2017 at 09:03 PM.

26th August 2017, 10:33 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,225	This indeed a Sulu barong, in fact it probably belonged to a datu and is a working datu barong. Datu working barongs used for everyday work had the tail part and nose parts like this one. Those with these elaborations are called junggayan style, and you have a datu junggayan barong. Kronckew is right in that these were often broken off in later years. The junggayan style of barong and kris is understood to be from the late 1800s. So I would guess that your piece is from the late 1800s to the early 20th century. Now I am not surprised that a later owner tried to match a scabbard to this and thus the reason why they don't fit together. (It is also possible but less likely that the wood shrank so much that it won't wrap around the blade.) In fact your blade appears wider than the scabbard. On the blade edge, the shape looks like it is beveled. If it is, this too is a little less common and is called a shadrigan blade. Where the blade and the hilt meet, is that copper or brass? Congratulations on a nice first piece!

26th August 2017, 11:16 PM	#4
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,857	Lovely example...congrats! Always so nice to see one of these with the pommel complete. It is obvious even from period photos that the lovely pommel carvings were frequently broken off. Great get!