Another eBay bolo to clean up

Treeslicer · 8th April 2018, 02:05 AM

Just won this.

I'll post photos once it's here, and cleaned up a bit. In the meantime, here's the link to the completed auction w/photos.

Looks like some sort of Luzon bolo to me, with the side/top faceted semi-figural horn hilt, plate-reinforced peened tang, faceted ferrule to match hilt, pinky cut-out, general shape, etc. Any other ideas on it? I wonder how in blazes it got to the bottom of a mine shaft in Butte, Montana?

Another rusty ethnographic pigsticker

Rick · 8th April 2018, 07:00 AM

https://missoulacurrent.com/opinion/...a-history-war/
You should upload pictures to the site; for the database.

Treeslicer · 8th April 2018, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

https://missoulacurrent.com/opinion/...a-history-war/
You should upload pictures to the site; for the database.

Here, and maybe there too, as soon as I have it, and have cleaned it up enough to bring out the design worked into the blade. I'm wondering exactly what that's going to turn out to be.

Is it considered respectable to stabilize and restore horn-hilt insect damage with polymer fillers?

Sajen · 8th April 2018, 01:08 PM

Hello Treeslicer,

I've been so free to post some pictures from the ebay auction. I would call it bolo, itak or matulis. Personally I wouldn't hold on to much on a specific name. Robert, Ian or Jose will be able to tell you from where on Luzon this piece coming. I don't think that the damage of the hilt is insect bite but coming from moisture. Here you can see similar pieces from my own collection: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=itak
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=itak

Sajen · 8th April 2018, 01:15 PM

And I forget, I personally wouldn't try to restore the hilt, I just would oil it.

Regards,
Detlef

Treeslicer · 8th April 2018, 01:59 PM

Thanks very much for the links, Detlef, and for posting the photos. The linked photos you provided seem to confirm my guess at the ID. Has anyone seen one marked "PM" before?

Sajen · 8th April 2018, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treeslicer

Has anyone seen one marked "PM" before?

Yes, many times, it's a very common marking.

Regards,
Detlef

BBJW · 8th April 2018, 07:03 PM

Could it be that it is a homemade knife that by just coincidence looks like a bolo? Bowie clip point blade?

Sajen · 8th April 2018, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBJW

Could it be that it is a homemade knife that by just coincidence looks like a bolo? Bowie clip point blade?

Hello BBJW,

definitely not IMVHO.

Treeslicer · 8th April 2018, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BBJW

Could it be that it is a homemade knife that by just coincidence looks like a bolo? Bowie clip point blade?

Completely matching every diagnostic point of a known Luzon bolo type is several coincidences too many, IMHO.

Ian · 9th April 2018, 07:36 AM

TS:

This is an Ilokano knife with a "double-clipped" blade--a common knife style. The hilt with a small "pinky" notch is also typical of Ilokano work. The wooden(?) hilt is in rough shape and has been "weathered," but overall I don't think this knife is particularly old--probably post-WWII. Knives of this style were common bringback items by U.S. servicemen in WWII and later.

Ian.

Treeslicer · 9th April 2018, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

TS:

This is an Ilokano knife with a "double-clipped" blade--a common knife style. The hilt with a small "pinky" notch is also typical of Ilokano work. The wooden(?) hilt is in rough shape and has been "weathered," but overall I don't think this knife is particularly old--probably post-WWII. Knives of this style were common bringback items by U.S. servicemen in WWII and later.

Ian.

Yup. Going through stuff already posted here (including yours), I'd picked up a few of the Ilokano characteristics to look for (which is how I spotted this item). One thing that caught my attention as a deviation from the usual 1940's-and-later Clark-area bringback is the elevated protrusion at the ricasso (similar to some of the examples that Detlef linked). What (if anything) does that characteristic tell us about the provenance? At this point, my ignorance of such details is vast.

Ian · 11th April 2018, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treeslicer

... One thing that caught my attention as a deviation from the usual 1940's-and-later Clark-area bringback is the elevated protrusion at the ricasso (similar to some of the examples that Detlef linked). What (if anything) does that characteristic tell us about the provenance? ...

Good question! The "nub" at forte on these knives is interesting and I'm not sure if it is an Ilokano feature or is shared more widely. I'm inclined to think the latter, although there are many Ilokano blades that have this feature. So far, it has not been linked to a particular region. A decade or so ago, some of our older members who no longer post here described knives from Batangas with the same feature.

Your question needs more research.

Ian.

Treeslicer · 16th April 2018, 10:41 PM

Here's some photos. As you can see, restoration has begun. The hilt is horn, not wood. The most proximal part of the pecked-out design spells out "PHILIPPINES", and the blade is right-hand chisel-ground.

Ian · 17th April 2018, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treeslicer

... The most proximal part of the pecked-out design spells out "PHILIPPINES", and the blade is right-hand chisel-ground.

Should be a V-grind on an Ilokano knife. The inscription is typical of post-WWII knives from Central Luzon.

Ian

8th April 2018, 02:05 AM	#1
Treeslicer Member Join Date: Feb 2018 Posts: 65	Another eBay bolo to clean up Just won this. I'll post photos once it's here, and cleaned up a bit. In the meantime, here's the link to the completed auction w/photos. Looks like some sort of Luzon bolo to me, with the side/top faceted semi-figural horn hilt, plate-reinforced peened tang, faceted ferrule to match hilt, pinky cut-out, general shape, etc. Any other ideas on it? I wonder how in blazes it got to the bottom of a mine shaft in Butte, Montana? Another rusty ethnographic pigsticker

8th April 2018, 01:08 PM	#4
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,794	Hello Treeslicer, I've been so free to post some pictures from the ebay auction. I would call it bolo, itak or matulis. Personally I wouldn't hold on to much on a specific name. Robert, Ian or Jose will be able to tell you from where on Luzon this piece coming. I don't think that the damage of the hilt is insect bite but coming from moisture. Here you can see similar pieces from my own collection: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=itak http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=itak Attached Images

16th April 2018, 10:41 PM	#14
Treeslicer Member Join Date: Feb 2018 Posts: 65	Here's some photos. As you can see, restoration has begun. The hilt is horn, not wood. The most proximal part of the pecked-out design spells out "PHILIPPINES", and the blade is right-hand chisel-ground. Attached Images

8th April 2018, 07:00 AM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,294	https://missoulacurrent.com/opinion/...a-history-war/ You should upload pictures to the site; for the database.

8th April 2018, 01:15 PM	#5
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,794	And I forget, I personally wouldn't try to restore the hilt, I just would oil it. Regards, Detlef

8th April 2018, 01:59 PM	#6
Treeslicer Member Join Date: Feb 2018 Posts: 65	Thanks very much for the links, Detlef, and for posting the photos. The linked photos you provided seem to confirm my guess at the ID. Has anyone seen one marked "PM" before?

8th April 2018, 07:03 PM	#8
BBJW Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Idaho, USA Posts: 228	Could it be that it is a homemade knife that by just coincidence looks like a bolo? Bowie clip point blade?

9th April 2018, 07:36 AM	#11
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,207	TS: This is an Ilokano knife with a "double-clipped" blade--a common knife style. The hilt with a small "pinky" notch is also typical of Ilokano work. The wooden(?) hilt is in rough shape and has been "weathered," but overall I don't think this knife is particularly old--probably post-WWII. Knives of this style were common bringback items by U.S. servicemen in WWII and later. Ian.