Hilt Identification

GIO · 3rd May 2024, 06:01 PM

Could it be from Mindanao ?

Sajen · 3rd May 2024, 08:49 PM

To me it's a stylized makara handle, so a Sunda or Sumatra origin would be obvious to me.

A. G. Maisey · 3rd May 2024, 09:37 PM

Thank you gentlemen.

Your responses demonstrate the problem I have had to the present time.

Hopefully a few more people might like to post a confident opinion.

Is anybody able to nominate an authoritative reference?

Sajen · 3rd May 2024, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Is anybody able to nominate an authoritative reference?

Hello Alan,

Sadly no! But I think that it's indeed a stylized makara handle, compare it with a pedang handle from Lombok. Another possible origin.

When I am correct, we only have to look where makara handles were used, direct to mind coming Java, Sunda, Sumatra and Lombok.

A. G. Maisey · 3rd May 2024, 10:32 PM

It might well be so Detlef, but other people have had other ideas.

For myself, I do not know, & that's why I'm looking for some certainty.

kai · 3rd May 2024, 11:42 PM

Hello Alan,

No convincing, much less any confident opinion from my side, I'm afraid.

Pics from more angles may help. How old would you estimate this hilt to be? (From the pic, the carving quality doesn't seem to be especially high...)

However, in my opinion, any similarity would need to be really close to allow for any reasonable inference on its origin (or even possible meaning).

Regards,
Kai

Ian · 4th May 2024, 12:06 AM

Hello Alan,

You have presented a real test. Like most who have posted already, I don't recognize this pommel. However, I would like to comment on what we can see of the rest of this hilt. The grip area seems to be hexagonal in cross-section. That strikes me as unusual for an Indonesian bladed weapon or tool. You are far more expert on Indonesian knives and swords than anyone here, so perhaps you could comment on this feature of your hilt.

Multifaceted hilts are very common in the Philippines, and I wonder whether there is a multicultural aspect to this hilt. If your hilt were a recognized pattern, you would have found an answer to its origins by now. It seems to be unique. For me, that always raises the possibility of a multicultural item that has been influenced by an element foreign to the local one.

3rd May 2024, 09:37 PM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,743	Thank you gentlemen. Your responses demonstrate the problem I have had to the present time. Hopefully a few more people might like to post a confident opinion. Is anybody able to nominate an authoritative reference? Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 3rd May 2024 at 09:49 PM.

3rd May 2024, 06:01 PM	#1
GIO Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 313	Could it be from Mindanao ?

3rd May 2024, 08:49 PM	#2
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,574	To me it's a stylized makara handle, so a Sunda or Sumatra origin would be obvious to me.

3rd May 2024, 10:32 PM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,743	It might well be so Detlef, but other people have had other ideas. For myself, I do not know, & that's why I'm looking for some certainty.

3rd May 2024, 11:42 PM	#6
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,228	Hello Alan, No convincing, much less any confident opinion from my side, I'm afraid. Pics from more angles may help. How old would you estimate this hilt to be? (From the pic, the carving quality doesn't seem to be especially high...) However, in my opinion, any similarity would need to be really close to allow for any reasonable inference on its origin (or even possible meaning). Regards, Kai

4th May 2024, 12:06 AM	#7
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,052	Hello Alan, You have presented a real test. Like most who have posted already, I don't recognize this pommel. However, I would like to comment on what we can see of the rest of this hilt. The grip area seems to be hexagonal in cross-section. That strikes me as unusual for an Indonesian bladed weapon or tool. You are far more expert on Indonesian knives and swords than anyone here, so perhaps you could comment on this feature of your hilt. Multifaceted hilts are very common in the Philippines, and I wonder whether there is a multicultural aspect to this hilt. If your hilt were a recognized pattern, you would have found an answer to its origins by now. It seems to be unique. For me, that always raises the possibility of a multicultural item that has been influenced by an element foreign to the local one.