5th November 2010, 10:23 PM | #1 |
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New Moro kris
Hello,
just win this kris for small money by e-pray. 1900-1920?? Which tribe or area? Here the pictures from the seller. Thank you very much for all comments and references, Detlef |
5th November 2010, 11:59 PM | #2 |
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The blade may be older .
Low money ? I believe the scabbard style is from Mindanao . It may be a mix of blade and dress . Mountings look old (not as old as the blade) to me . Congratulations Sajen . Last edited by Rick; 6th November 2010 at 12:10 AM. |
6th November 2010, 12:36 AM | #3 |
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Rick got the right island.
I would put it at Maguindanao tribe, which is on the east side of the island of Mindanao. Age - perhaps 1920-1940? The blade however is definitely older, late 1800s to 1900? Good that it has a separate ganga. |
6th November 2010, 12:42 AM | #4 |
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I definitely admit to confusion, Jose .
Maguindanao, Maranao, I get those two mixed up . |
6th November 2010, 01:03 AM | #5 |
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Thank you Rick and Jose for assign the origin and age of the kris. I special like the old cloth wrap/anting-anting at the sheath.
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6th November 2010, 02:58 AM | #6 |
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Rick - it would be easy to confuse the two, they are next door neighbors!
Sajen - you are welcome and I did not even see the mansala (cloth) until you mentioned it...... Also a light etch might bring out a pattern in the blade. |
7th November 2010, 03:12 PM | #7 | |
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17th November 2010, 06:40 PM | #8 |
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Yesterday I received the kris and I was enjoyable surprised. The handle fittings seem to be from silver plated brass and the asang-asang from silver (not tested until now). The sheath is from very soft wood but is in good condition. I have cleaned all, the blade I start to polish to be able to etch it the next days.
Here some fast taken pictures by lamplight so please excuse the quality. |
17th November 2010, 09:02 PM | #9 |
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Congratulations! Silver plate was common among the Maguindanao and Maranao.
Cleaned up nicely. Can't wait to see the laminations in the blade. |
17th November 2010, 10:01 PM | #10 |
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Thank you Jose. The lamination is existent but will need some time until the blade is clean and I have time to etch the blade.
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18th November 2010, 08:39 PM | #11 | |
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Hello Detlef,
I do like the really old blade - nice style and good scrollwork! BTW, what's the blade length? Is this later pommel style more common in the upriver region rather than downriver? OTOH, since the crest obviously got broken off, it may have been sanded down from more elaborate kakatua forms; the angular grip seems to be a later development on Mindanao though. Quote:
If you were feeling adventurous (or bored ), you could try to get the hilt off: Due to the attachment strips running outside the ferrule, there's a good chance that you can detach the asang-asang and hilt without any damage. Of course, this will make cleaning and etching the blade much easier. More important would be IMHO that you could try to reattach the hilt with the attachment strips running inside the ferrule which should look a lot nicer. Regards, Kai |
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19th November 2010, 12:57 AM | #12 |
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Hello Kai,
thank you for your usual informed comment. The length is 57 cm (22.4 inch). I am not sure that the crest got broken off formerly, I think I have seen this form before but I may be wrong. The blade wasn't clean down from the hilt at the gangya area but it was done this evening and I have etched the blade. The reaction was very fast and you can see the result by the attached images. In the moment I am afraid to open the hilt because I am not used with this technic, maybe later when I am trained by this. Please let all know me what you think about the result, was the etch to strong? |
19th November 2010, 03:11 AM | #13 |
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Interesting and subtle laminations...........
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19th November 2010, 06:54 PM | #14 | |
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Quote:
What do think about the pommel? Is it recarved or original like this? Best regards, Detlef |
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19th November 2010, 07:27 PM | #15 |
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Hard to say for sure, would need to see details of the back end of the pommel.
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19th November 2010, 08:35 PM | #16 |
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Here some close-up's to get a imagination of the pommel's shape. Hope it helps.
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19th November 2010, 08:48 PM | #17 |
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It looks to me that it might have been recarved after a breakage. I know the type of kakatua you are referring to that has a similar profile that seem to have popped up in early 20th pieces, but i don't think this is one of them.
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19th November 2010, 08:56 PM | #18 | |
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Quote:
Last edited by Sajen; 19th November 2010 at 10:54 PM. |
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19th November 2010, 09:16 PM | #19 |
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Hard to tell, but I think this could be original. I have had ones similar to this. (Thus I would leave the pommel alone)
Below is one Maguindanao one that I had and restored (only picture of it is on Federico's site) with silver around the top: |
19th November 2010, 09:23 PM | #20 | |
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19th November 2010, 09:47 PM | #21 |
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The last light of the afternoon was just fading, but i had enough time to get this quick shot if it helps.
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19th November 2010, 11:30 PM | #22 |
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Yep that's the one! Glad you have it - it was one of my early pieces and after restoration I sold it.
Notice the pommel - same profile. Again congratulations David - I kind of miss that one (even used it in an escrima demonstration once! ). |
20th November 2010, 12:33 AM | #23 |
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Nice etch, you can always lighten it a bit with more polishing .
I don't think this pommel is a recarve . Were I you; I would not attempt to unmount it . I expect the work for better or worse is of local origin . As such, IMO, it should be left alone . You got a good sword . |
20th November 2010, 11:25 AM | #24 | |
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Quote:
Yes, same profile of the pommel! Very nice kris you have got from Jose and great restore job from him. It seems from the picture Jose posted that it have nearly the same way of lamination. Last edited by Sajen; 20th November 2010 at 01:27 PM. |
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20th November 2010, 11:30 AM | #25 | |
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20th November 2010, 01:23 PM | #26 | |
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20th November 2010, 01:45 PM | #27 |
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Here a second example of the same pommel style from Oriental-Arms.
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20th November 2010, 03:30 PM | #28 |
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Yes that is why I with Rick say to leave the pommel alone - it appears to be a Maguindanao style.
And yes I sold mine to Spunger originally. A great piece (too bad I needed the money at the time ). Thank for the comments Sajen. One of my earliest restoration projects. |
21st November 2010, 02:21 AM | #29 |
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Examples of this pommel style which were obviously original never show a distinct beak (i. e. both, beak and crest, heavily stylized). Since Detlef's examples has a distinct beak and also the flow of lines where the crest could have been seems to be unusual, I'd guess that the original pommel got recarved a long time ago.
Regards, Kai |
21st November 2010, 03:13 AM | #30 | |
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