Coming back to y'all with another Keris!

maximummason · 4th March 2021, 07:58 AM

Dear friends,
The last time I posted on here with help on a Keris, I recieved many helpful pieces of information and advice. Thank you for that. Today I won a eBay auction for another Keris, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on it regarding age and regional style. Personally to me, nothing really sticks out except for the complex Dapur. I have yet to see one that is as "Extra" as this one is. Again, many thanks for your thoughts and time...

Max

Rick · 4th March 2021, 10:40 PM

I wonder if this is a modified blade. The work on the sorsoran is of extremely poor quality .
I have no idea of what dapur this may be called.

But.
The mendak looks old and the wood of the ukiran seems to show very nice figuring in the grain.

mariusgmioc · 4th March 2021, 10:44 PM

I don't know about kerises, but the two cuts were made at a later time by mechanical means (most likely by sawing or grinding).

Rick · 4th March 2021, 10:50 PM

The wrongko could probably use a gentle cleaning, it looks dingy in your photos.

Rick · 4th March 2021, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

I don't know about kerises, but the two cuts were made at a later time by mechanical means (most likely by sawing or grinding).

There's no erosion of those edges of the cuts which I would take as evidence of modification done there.

David · 5th March 2021, 12:59 AM

Oh, i have no doubt this keris was modified, and not with any particular skill either. I am sorry to say that this was most probably done to make a low grade keris more interesting for sale in the marketplace. You can find this as a legitimate dhapur which i believe might be called dhapur trisulo, but this would not be a good example of that.

maximummason · 5th March 2021, 02:13 AM

Dear all,
Seems like you might be right. I don't have it in my hands yet, but it's unfortunate to hear that. I am really confused as to why someone would ruin a perfectly good piece. You win some you lose some, i guess....

JustYS · 5th March 2021, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

I don't know about kerises, but the two cuts were made at a later time by mechanical means (most likely by sawing or grinding).

IMHO, also the second kembang kacang (near greneng) were added at a later time.

Original Dhapur (before being modified) might be Dhapur Mayat.

A. G. Maisey · 5th March 2021, 05:36 AM

Yes, altered, what we call "keris robahan".

Originally this was a pretty reasonable village level keris, then somebody took to it with an axe --- well, maybe not an axe, but a file or hacksaw or something. Pity.

Ive seen this alteration done to better quality keris, and done skillfully, and they don't look too bad, but this alteration has been roughly done.

I do not know this form, nor anything like it as a legitimate dhapur, but Dhapur Sategal sort of comes close.

David, I've never heard of Dhapur Trisulo for a keris, where did you pick up the name?

All the dress is FAQ, untidy, but it would restore well.

Jean · 5th March 2021, 09:51 AM

I would just say that this is a gayaman kris from Yogyakarta, what a shame to have mistreated the blade this way, the culprit shoud be executed!

David · 5th March 2021, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

David, I've never heard of Dhapur Trisulo for a keris, where did you pick up the name?

I hate to say that i am uncertain which book these dhapur drawing come from. I believe they may have come from Empu Djeno. I don't own the book they are from so i can't confirm that. Anyway, i downloaded a bunch of them off the web a while back. The one called Trisulo is a little different, with two kembang kacang near the tip of the blade.

SidJ · 5th March 2021, 11:58 PM

Isn't the handle on backwards?

Rick · 6th March 2021, 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximummason

Dear all,
Seems like you might be right. I don't have it in my hands yet, but it's unfortunate to hear that. I am really confused as to why someone would ruin a perfectly good piece. You win some you lose some, i guess....

Knowledge is a real money saver Max.
We have a great archive of the stuff available using the search function here.

A. G. Maisey · 6th March 2021, 02:46 AM

Thanks David.

Yeah, that looks like it comes from Pak Djeno's dhapur sheet:-

http://www.kerisattosanaji.com/DHAPU...NGTODJENO.html

I regret I cannot make a favourable remark here, so I'll say nothing.

David · 6th March 2021, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SidJ

Isn't the handle on backwards?

Yes it is. A 180 degree turn would set it correctly.

David · 6th March 2021, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Thanks David.

Yeah, that looks like it comes from Pak Djeno's dhapur sheet:-

http://www.kerisattosanaji.com/DHAPU...NGTODJENO.html

I regret I cannot make a favourable remark here, so I'll say nothing.

No worries Alan. I was simply trying to establish that at least some people see this dhapur as a legitimate one. I don't know that i have ever seen this dhapur on a keris that was originally forged this way though. I've personally never been fond of this type of alteration.

A. G. Maisey · 6th March 2021, 09:13 PM

David, from what I have seen of this form of keris it is something that started to appear during the 1960's in Jogja.

"1960's" is a guess, I've never seen one that I could definitely place pre-WWII.

Jogja is not a guess.

4th March 2021, 07:58 AM	#1
maximummason Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Posts: 6	Coming back to y'all with another Keris! Dear friends, The last time I posted on here with help on a Keris, I recieved many helpful pieces of information and advice. Thank you for that. Today I won a eBay auction for another Keris, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on it regarding age and regional style. Personally to me, nothing really sticks out except for the complex Dapur. I have yet to see one that is as "Extra" as this one is. Again, many thanks for your thoughts and time... Max Attached Images

5th March 2021, 02:13 AM	#7
maximummason Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Posts: 6	Reply Dear all, Seems like you might be right. I don't have it in my hands yet, but it's unfortunate to hear that. I am really confused as to why someone would ruin a perfectly good piece. You win some you lose some, i guess....

4th March 2021, 10:40 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	I wonder if this is a modified blade. The work on the sorsoran is of extremely poor quality . I have no idea of what dapur this may be called. But. The mendak looks old and the wood of the ukiran seems to show very nice figuring in the grain.

4th March 2021, 10:44 PM	#3
mariusgmioc Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Austria Posts: 1,903	I don't know about kerises, but the two cuts were made at a later time by mechanical means (most likely by sawing or grinding).

4th March 2021, 10:50 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	The wrongko could probably use a gentle cleaning, it looks dingy in your photos.

5th March 2021, 12:59 AM	#6
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,123	Oh, i have no doubt this keris was modified, and not with any particular skill either. I am sorry to say that this was most probably done to make a low grade keris more interesting for sale in the marketplace. You can find this as a legitimate dhapur which i believe might be called dhapur trisulo, but this would not be a good example of that.

5th March 2021, 05:36 AM	#9
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	Yes, altered, what we call "keris robahan". Originally this was a pretty reasonable village level keris, then somebody took to it with an axe --- well, maybe not an axe, but a file or hacksaw or something. Pity. Ive seen this alteration done to better quality keris, and done skillfully, and they don't look too bad, but this alteration has been roughly done. I do not know this form, nor anything like it as a legitimate dhapur, but Dhapur Sategal sort of comes close. David, I've never heard of Dhapur Trisulo for a keris, where did you pick up the name? All the dress is FAQ, untidy, but it would restore well.

5th March 2021, 09:51 AM	#10
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	I would just say that this is a gayaman kris from Yogyakarta, what a shame to have mistreated the blade this way, the culprit shoud be executed!

5th March 2021, 11:58 PM	#12
SidJ Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 177	Isn't the handle on backwards?

6th March 2021, 02:46 AM	#14
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	Thanks David. Yeah, that looks like it comes from Pak Djeno's dhapur sheet:- http://www.kerisattosanaji.com/DHAPU...NGTODJENO.html I regret I cannot make a favourable remark here, so I'll say nothing.

6th March 2021, 09:13 PM	#17
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	David, from what I have seen of this form of keris it is something that started to appear during the 1960's in Jogja. "1960's" is a guess, I've never seen one that I could definitely place pre-WWII. Jogja is not a guess.