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#1 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
Posts: 94
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Hello.
I originally picked these two spears up as part of a collection a few years ago, and then a friend told me that they were Moro. Until just the other day, I never thought anything about it, but now that I've taken another look at them, I think that they might be Indonesian. Possibly Javanese? The one with the longer blade measures 79 1/2" in overall length. The shaft is black palmwood, and the spearhead stands 13 1/4" from tip to the top of the brass ferrule. The spear with the small leaf shaped blade measures 84 1/2" in overall length. The head is about 6 1/2" from tip to top of the brass ferrule. The shaft on this one is also Palm. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you, Joe Last edited by Clubs & Arrows; 1st September 2010 at 04:28 PM. |
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#2 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,209
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I think these spears come from Sumatra or Borneo. The one with the large spearhead could be a Moro Budiak. It probably is.
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#3 |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
Posts: 94
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Hi Henk,
Thank you for your help. Best regards, Joe |
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#4 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,209
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Hi Joe,
You're welcome. |
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#5 |
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 8,711
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I also would Indonesia but not from Java. Most probable from Sumatra like Henk write.
Detlef |
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#6 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
Posts: 94
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Sajen,
Thank you for your help on figuring these out. Best regards, Joe |
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#7 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,282
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Close ups of the bases (methuk) of these spearheads might be enlightening .
Would also like to see the heads themselves photographed in daylight . |
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#8 |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
Posts: 94
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Hi Rick,
Here are a few outdoor shots. Sorry about the shadows in some of the pics. Thanks again for any help, Joe |
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#9 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,282
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Thank you .
![]() It seems the larger one has pamor . The facets on the methuk area are unfamiliar to me . ![]() A four sided tang on the large spear ? |
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#10 |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
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Hi Rick,
Yes the tang is four sided. I've had both Moro and non-Moro opinions on this spear. Does the band of triangles encircling the shaft seem familiar? Any help with this would be appreciated. Thanks again, Joe |
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#11 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,282
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There are some differences in the tang construction of Javanese spears :
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=12310 The square tang is unusual to me; I admit to being puzzled . I don't believe I've seen a square tang on a Javanese spear; that's not saying much though . The head is firmly attached to the shaft, and not removable ? |
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#12 |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
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Hi Rick,
I was able to get the head out to photograph the tang. Any ideas on origin? Thanks, Joe ![]() |
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#13 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,282
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I have seen Javanese spears with this blade profile .
What throws me off is from the Methuk to the tang ... ![]() Usually this area shows more work in the completion; usually a flared part above the tang that hides it when mounted on a haft . ![]() Any chance this could be from Nias ? I sure can't anchor it to one particular area; it has both Indonesian and Moro aspects . Last edited by Rick; 3rd September 2010 at 03:46 PM. |
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#14 |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Gabriel Foothills, Southern California
Posts: 94
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Rick,
When I purchased this from the previous owner's estate, I did also pick up a Nias stool, so it is possible. One of the problems is that when I purchased the spear, it was along with a lot of Philippine, Oceanic, African, and other Southeast Asian material. Kind of an ethnographic mixed bag. I'll certainly start looking towards Nias to see if I can find anything similar. Thanks again, Joe |
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#15 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,209
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I cann't get rid of the idea this one is Phillipine.
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#16 |
Vikingsword Staff
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Posts: 6,282
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It's tempting to do so Henk .
Me, I'm just not sure . The blade looks like it has been ritually washed a few times . I'm seeing a topographic surface on this blade . |
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#17 |
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Location: The Netherlands
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I can imagine Rick. You mentioned before you see pamor on the blade. I tried to discover if i could see the same, maybe it is pamor indeed but i thought it were more forging lines of folding of the metal during forging. I also see some rustspurs. Only in the middle of the blade i see something, but in my opinion that is more twistcore. The blade is in my opinion more comparable with a Moro Budiak.
I cann't see the spurs of ritual washing of this blade on the pics. For me this is a blade i have to hold in my hands to give a good comment. Fact is it is a beauty and very nice to discuss. |
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#18 |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,249
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I'm pretty sure, the larger one is not Moro - the flow of lines doesn't seem to fit...
Regards, Kai |
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#19 | |
Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 2,222
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![]() Quote:
The hexagonal base makes me think of Atjeh. same as the outer line of the blade. The tang is a problem. Normally Atjeh or Sumatra spears have a round tappering tang with a twist near the end. and not this square type without the twist. Maybe some mix bewteen Nias and Sumatra/ Atjeh influences ? I have another strange spearhead for discussion. Will open another thread in order not to confuse this one even more ![]() Best regards, Willem |
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