Ram's head khanjar for comment

[Jens Nordlunde]

Could be that it was made in cire-perdy (or however it is spelled). In that case there would likely only be one example.

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by Jens Nordlunde

Could be that it was made in cire-perdy (or however it is spelled). In that case there would likely only be one example.

Cire-perdue (lost-wax) process maybe if it were bronze but almost certainly not iron.

On second thoughts, I doubt that the horns can be cast even in bronze with the wax process.

[Battara]

Horns can be done in lost wax, but if iron - crazy difficult and in parts.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

Cire-perdue (lost-wax) process maybe if it were bronze but almost certainly not iron.

I think sand casting would be the method for making an iron / steel hilt, lost wax is good for metals with a low melting point. With sand casting I do not think you would get as much detail as you would with lost wax.

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by estcrh

I think sand casting would be the method for making an iron / steel hilt, lost wax is good for metals with a low melting point. With sand casting I do not think you would get as much detail as you would with lost wax.

Exactly! That's why after casting, the Iron hilts need to be processed to give them the desired finish and detail.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Another rams head

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

More rams...http://suroorasia.blogspot.com/2014/...-oriental.html shows an excellent multiple and is from a very famous author...

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

Another rams head ...two in fact... On Jewelery for comparison...

Persian gold.

Beautiful Achaemenid Persian solid gold bracelet, featuring a woven design on the band, with two ram heads mounted on each terminal. Each ram heads are realistically rendered and are decorated with intricate and abstract patterns. Rams in ancient Persia were held in high regard as they were seen as a symbol of virility. These styles of bracelets can be traced back to Persepolis, the capital city of ancient Persia and were usually found in the ancient Royal courts of the city. This particular bracelet was likely a tribute to the King. Weight: 3.5 oz.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by ariel

Yes, Indo-Persian Khanjar.
The handle is old, with spots of rust, tarnish and pitting.
The blade, however, is pristine and the wootz pattern is very similar to modern Indian examples.
There is some black mastique oozing from the slit in the handle. Epoxy?
Where did you get it from?
Rajastan?
I am sorry for my paranoid remarks, but that's IMHO.

After seeing some clearly modern but well made swords with wootz blades and hilts being sold on Ebay I think this whole dagger may in fact be a new creation. Here is an example.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

More rams...http://suroorasia.blogspot.com/2014/...-oriental.html shows an excellent multiple and is from a very famous author...

Enamelled Dagger National Museum, New Delhi (India)
Late 17th Century
Place of Origin: Rajasthan, Rajput
Materials: Steel
Dimensions: L: 34.9 cm.


The ram-shaped hilt of metal is profusely encrusted with rubies, emeralds and other jewels. The sheath of metal is delicately perforated with images of birds, animals and creeper designs.

[mariusgmioc]

Originally Posted by estcrh

After seeing some clearly modern but well made swords with wootz blades and hilts being sold on Ebay I think this whole dagger may in fact be a new creation. Here is an example.

Contrary to my initial oppinion, I concede that you may be right. There are indeed quite a few very good, traditional, but newly made wootz blades on the market. And they are sold as antiques.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

Contrary to my initial oppinion, I concede that you may be right. There are indeed quite a few very good, traditional, but newly made wootz blades on the market. And they are sold as antiques.

If what I have seen is what I think it is then this very scary. People are being fooled by a new wootz that is a step above what has previously been called "wootz". The swords I have seen have no scabbard or obviously newly made ones, and the swords show no sigh of wear / age etc but they are fooling people, some are selling for a lot of money.

Take a look at this, the cracks in the metal, the lack of wear, the wootz pattern, there is some red rust, this makes me think that the steel rams head dagger being discussed here is of the same type, a modern made replica. The rams head hilt is atypical with other similar examples and while it is pitted there is no sign of wear as you would expect to see on a 100+yr old dagger and there is a small amount of what looks like red rust on it as well. To many warning signs in my opinion.

[Cthulhu]

I'm glad we're moving towards consensus. On the other hand, it's a disappointing consensus.

Oh well; they can't all be antiques.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by Cthulhu

I'm glad we're moving towards consensus. On the other hand, it's a disappointing consensus.

Oh well; they can't all be antiques.

There is still no smoking gun but there is a lot of room for doubt. On the bright side, even if newly made it is an excellent example showing some skill and workmanship not often seen in modern made examples. Many people would not mind owning your dagger even if they knew for sure that it was newly made.

[Ian]

Cthulhu:

I don't think you should feel guilty or ashamed for buying a nice dagger believing it was perhaps older than it is. There is a strong market for these well made knives and they are produced within a culture that has been making them for centuries. It's a genuine Indian knife made in an older style, but probably produced recently and not an antique. We all live and learn.

I know a few people who would pay several hundred dollars for such a knife.

Originally Posted by Cthulhu

I'm glad we're moving towards consensus. On the other hand, it's a disappointing consensus.

Oh well; they can't all be antiques.