|
14th March 2009, 07:15 PM
|
#31 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Some more.
|
|
|
|
14th March 2009, 07:33 PM
|
#32 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
And more ...
|
|
|
|
|
14th March 2009, 07:42 PM
|
#33 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
More ...
|
|
|
|
|
14th March 2009, 08:02 PM
|
#34 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
More.
|
|
|
|
|
14th March 2009, 08:07 PM
|
#35 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
That's it for today.
Not to forget something that might be of special interest to you, Fernando, compadre mio - well, actually I assume that you are a member of this Society!  Michael |
|
|
|
|
15th March 2009, 03:49 AM
|
#36 | |
|
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: PR, USA
Posts: 679
|
Art is such a window into the past...a poorman's Time Travel Machine.
Did you guys notice the existence of both round and sharp tipped KBs? Thank You Very Much for sharing these, Michael. Best Regards M Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
15th March 2009, 04:38 AM
|
#37 | |
|
Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: PR, USA
Posts: 679
|
Hi Jim, as always, you show a keen eye.
: ) Seems I'm inordenately attracted to swedish swords, I have no idea why. Regarding knowledge, I do believe Khanjar is far more versed in that area. Best M Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
15th March 2009, 09:25 PM
|
#38 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Woodcuts of 1524 and 1537 respectively, depicting Katzbalgers and an early two hand sword with figure eight quillons.
Fom Kintzertorium's photostream on www.flickr.com. Michael |
|
|
|
|
16th March 2009, 05:50 PM
|
#39 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
These two woodcuts are by Daniel Hopfer, both ca. 1525.
Michael |
|
|
|
|
16th March 2009, 05:57 PM
|
#40 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
A bit more on early swords, all from flickr.com.
The authors of these are credited by giving their flickr. akas together with each picture. Michael |
|
|
|
|
16th March 2009, 06:02 PM
|
#41 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
More.
|
|
|
|
|
16th March 2009, 06:05 PM
|
#42 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Done for today.
m |
|
|
|
|
18th March 2009, 11:48 PM
|
#43 |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
katzbalgers
very nice pictures, I have 4 rare katzbalgers in my collection, one
published by J.Ypey. I will place some pictures in this thread coming weekend. |
|
|
|
|
19th March 2009, 05:22 PM
|
#44 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Paintig of St. George, Swiss, ca. 1510, and a woodcut depicting hand-and-a-half swords from a fencing book of 1558.
Michael |
|
|
|
|
19th March 2009, 05:29 PM
|
#45 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
A Katzbalger and two Boar Swords
The first boar sword, ca. 1510-20, sold at auction Galerie Fischer, Lucerne, Switzerland, May 19,1933.
The others preserved at the Deutsches Klingenmuseum (blade museum) Solingen. The boar sword ca. 1515, the Katzbalger ca. 1530. Michael |
|
|
|
|
19th March 2009, 05:32 PM
|
#46 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Cornelistromp,
We look forward to seeing your pieces! Michael |
|
|
|
|
19th March 2009, 10:04 PM
|
#47 |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
katzbalger 1500-1520
|
|
|
|
|
20th March 2009, 06:03 PM
|
#48 |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
katzbalger early 16thC.
I found a similar piece in the "historischen Museum" in Bern Switserland vgl. Wegeli Schwerter und Dolche nr 172 |
|
|
|
|
20th March 2009, 06:52 PM
|
#49 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Both of them seem to be very fine pieces, Cornelis - thank you for sharing!
I am tempted to assign a date of ca. 1530 to the first because of its thickly ribbed pommel. Those ribs closely correspond to those found on both contemporary armor and barrels. Is it posible to take a few good details of the brass grip showing its line decoration? That would be great. You sure are one very lucky guy to get those, congratulations. All the best, Michael |
|
|
|
|
20th March 2009, 07:27 PM
|
#50 |
|
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 332
|
Cornelistromp, these are wonderful items, thank you for posting. So far I like #2 in particular, bacause of the "munition grade" appearance, not counting the unusual decoration of the copper (?) rivets in the guard. I would love to see a photo of all 4 swords togather, to see the entire blades and relative sizes.
|
|
|
|
|
20th March 2009, 07:33 PM
|
#51 |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
one side is a female saint Barbara with tower and feather at the reverse side
a man with a sword and a book probably saint Paul. this Katzbalger can be dated first quarter of the 16thC. Last edited by cornelistromp; 21st March 2009 at 06:39 PM. |
|
|
|
|
20th March 2009, 07:36 PM
|
#52 | |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
Quote:
ps:All the katzbalger of this particular type ( the 3 pieces I know) , have the same copper fillings at the quard. Last edited by cornelistromp; 20th March 2009 at 07:48 PM. |
|
|
|
|
|
21st March 2009, 06:09 PM
|
#53 |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
developed Katzbalger, spain 1540
Last edited by cornelistromp; 21st March 2009 at 06:49 PM. |
|
|
|
|
21st March 2009, 06:11 PM
|
#54 |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
katzbalger 4 waterfind.
Last edited by cornelistromp; 21st March 2009 at 06:56 PM. |
|
|
|
|
21st March 2009, 06:42 PM
|
#55 | |
|
Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: musorian territory
Posts: 424
|
Quote:
interesting picture there, in the painting with the knight with the white plumed helmet at his feet the made is depicted as being of african origin.... this is interesting, what is the meaning being displayed in the picture? or is this from some factuial event showing a individuial who exsisted in history?? or is it just the artist using artistic license to make the picture more interesting?? im sure there were some africans in europe at the time , as the were in the middle east and ottoman possetions , aspecialy in istabul. and although id presume they were for the most part held as slaves no doubt some would have been free or would have been able to get to non moslem areas where slavery was not common or forbidden. brings up another interesting topic, as to how much interacion there was medieval between the middle east and north africa and europe.. i have read some place that there is records dating from the 13th century showing arabs and persians being employed in the production of crossbows bars in london...... i wonder.. |
|
|
|
|
|
21st March 2009, 07:43 PM
|
#56 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Ausjulius,
The depiction that you referred to is part of an altar piece by Hans Baldung Grien called The Adoration of the Magi. According to the New Testament, one of the Magi was Melchior and he indeed is said to have been of African nationality. So this knight represents Melchior. Don't worry too much about seeing an African wearing a South German early Renaissance suit of armor. In fact, it has nothing to do with the actual historic clothing of African people 500 years ago. The reason why the master painter sort of put him into this armor lies in the fact that the early 16th century Germans who this altar piece was made for wished any work of art to reflect their own contemporary culture, including knightly suits of armor. When interpreting sources of illustration it is very important to keep in mind the general historic self image of people and both their religious basis and everyday environment at those periods of time. Michael |
|
|
|
|
24th March 2009, 02:12 AM
|
#57 | |
|
Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: musorian territory
Posts: 424
|
Quote:
i did not know the painting so i was interested in the origin of the image. i understand there is a german saint from roman times who was popular in the past in some parts of western germany , who is typicaly depicted as being of african origin..? |
|
|
|
|
|
24th March 2009, 03:42 AM
|
#58 |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Well, Ausjulius,
Actually the African King and Magi Melchior was not a specifically German person but a Christian Saint who, accompanied by two more kings (magi), had followed a star and come a long way from the East to see and adore the new born Jesus Christ. To be exact, The Lord Jesus Christ was not just popular in some parts of Western Germany at some time but has been one of the most imoprtant religious leaders wordwide for two thousand years. He founded Christianity. Michael |
|
|
|
|
24th March 2009, 03:50 AM
|
#59 | |
|
(deceased)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
|
Quote:
Hi Cornelius, May I repeat my request to get provided with some good detailed photographs of the figural representations on the brass grip of your first Katzbalger? Thanks in advance for putting up with any inconveniences of photography! Michael |
|
|
|
|
|
24th March 2009, 09:01 AM
|
#60 | |
|
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,058
|
Quote:
of course, i added some text ,are you not afraid of abuse of pictures? Best regards Last edited by cornelistromp; 24th March 2009 at 07:58 PM. |
|
|
|
|
 |
|
|
Linear Mode
