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#31 | |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND
Posts: 2,731
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I agree with the comments about NZ Post.They can be rather slack at times. As for the spear head being held by Customs, it would have been classed by our law as a double edged knife (dagger) which DOES require a permit to import here. If it was SINGLE edged then there should be no problem, so what I am saying is that a sword or knife (single edged) are generally OK without an import permit but DOUBLE edged need a Permit to Import to NZ. Bottom line here is that if one is buying from ANY COUNTRY, then it is the BUYERS responsibility to make sure that he or she has the right paperwork and is aware of the requirements to import an item. The Law your buyer needs to be aware of is the Customs Prohibition Import Act 2017. If he is not aware of it, then he should be IMHO. Stu |
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#32 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Aussie Bush
Posts: 4,165
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Having just imported my whole collection into Australia from the U.S., and encountered similar laws to those in New Zealand, I can understand the frustration of being treated capriciously by the Customs people. It really depended on who I spoke to on any given day. The local police were very bureaucratic but entirely consistent in what they told me, unlike Customs. Fortunately, I got nearly all of my pieces through the bureaucratic maze, but it took almost a year and several rounds of paperwork. When dealing with the Australian Customs (and perhaps Customs Officers most places), I would advise being very, very patient and don't get upset with them--it doesn't help and they have all the power!
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#33 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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The auction house I frequently buy from in Italy handles the export paperwork, you're right about the time frame but it's not an undue burden. I have no idea what the fee is since the dispatch portion of their invoice is all rolled into one number. |
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#34 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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As you say, it's the luck of the draw. With our Post Office, you can always drive a couple miles to a station in the next postal district to find a sensible employee there. |
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#35 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 98
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I have been trying to obtain shipping quotes for a small wooden mask coming up for sale in the USA. International shipping - I think we have a new stupid quote of the year.
A USPS store. "Hello Can you also quote on shipping of this item below. USPS and I have already had a quote of $120 USD. Thanks ***** *** What are the dimensions, weight and value of this mask? Thanks **** "16 x 9 x 4.5 inches. 1.3 KG approx or less. Value $150 USD approx. Thanks" **** "Good morning, Pick-up, packaging, and shipment is apprx. $735.69. Please advise is you'd like us to proceed. Thank you! ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
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#36 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,287
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I've never had any problems shipping internationally with the Post Office; UPS on the other hand...
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#37 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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OK, having said this: 1. It is an axiom that the US Snail will beat any of the commercial carriers regarding rates. That explains the differential in price mentioned in your post. In exchange for that bonus, you don't get the tracking reliability with the Snail service as the couriers offer. The exception is USPS Express Mail service, you get good performance but pay a premium for it. Still, for international shipping i find FedEx and UPS tracking to be tighter, but on the other hand FedEx no longer accepts weapons as stated in my prior posts. 2. You can get accurate rate quotes from the US Snail on their website calculator, at www.usps.com. You pay the same rate for all services whether you book online or do it over-the-counter. 3. You can likewise calculate rates for commercial carriers on their websites, www.FedEx.com or www.UPS.com. But be aware that these outfits quote different prices depending on your business status with them, and on what platform you are making your inquiry from. You'll get a certain rate as a private retail customer from the website calculator. If you have a business account and are a "volume shipper", you get a discount off the standard rate, how much depends on how much you ship per year. This amount is automatically calculated when you log in to your account before making an inquiry or purchasing service.. The WORST quotes are the ones you get on the phone or at the counter of the UPS Stores, or FedEx Offices. Those will induce real stickier shock, just as you experienced. I guess we can chalk it up to capitalism at work. Your experience can be likened to currency exchange when traveling -- do it at the airport and you're subjecting yourself to highway robbery. Using a no-fee or low-fee credit card geared for international business travelers will save you a bundle. In other words know the market and how the players operate to choose the best, or the least painful, option for yourself. Good luck, man! 3. |
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#38 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 98
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#39 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 36
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#40 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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#41 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 36
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#42 |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND
Posts: 2,731
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Further to #25 above regarding the sword sent to New Zealand by DHL Deutschepost, I should perhaps have added that the cost was 47Euro and the parcel weighed 1.78kg. Length was 1m. For the size and distance I would have thought that this cost was very reasonable. It would appear that from the comments posted, that the major part of shipping cost could well be the charge for packing etc.
Stu |
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#43 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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DHL just delivered an Indian dagger sent by a customer in Europe for blade polish. Described "Art metalwork, jammadar kattari, Indian >100 years old". Package not opened en route, no stickers or tape from CITES inspection. Took less than a week including a Sat./Sun. to get here.
My colleague in the Netherlands still uses UPS as well as Netherlands Post to send swords to the US. So that leaves FedEx as the absolute no-go for all weapons, antique or otherwise, between countries. (TNT has been bought out by them so it doesn't operate on its own anymore.) |
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#44 |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 90
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i received a dagger by fedex today
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#45 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,252
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Hello Udo,
Quote:
As collectors we also have to bear with idiosyncratic national regulations that surpass global standards like Italy on “weapons” even if antique/obsolete, the US and UK on antique ivory, and the list goes on and on... BTW, Czerny’s mentions the imposed regulatory processes and timeframe on the website if I remember correctly. Regards, Kai |
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#46 | |
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,252
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#47 |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 90
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My entry has nothing to do with italy or czernys
![]() I was talking about fedex being the worst shipping experience. |
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#48 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,252
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Thanks for your explanation! From the other comments in this thread it seems that you got really lucky to receive it at all and the parcel not getting returned to the sender...
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#49 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,740
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Just my personal experience with Czerny's and shipping from Italy to France:
I am regularly buying krisses and kris hilts from them, their shipping service is slow but it is partly justified because they have to go through the very bureaucratic Italian Customs regulations (export permit). Their shipping rates are quite high but no exorbitant (45 USD for shipping a balinese kris for instance, I always insist to get the best rate) and up to now I received the items safely. The direct consequence of the shipping problems to some destinations is that there are very few bidders as compared to other international auction houses and you can achieve excellent deals in some cases. Regards |
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#50 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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Ok so try this out: got a beja dagger at auction from Italy and paid around $240 in shipping alone! We'll see how it turns out when it comes in.
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#51 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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#52 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Malaysia
Posts: 311
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about a month ago i won a bid for a pair of kerisses of not v good quality but one had an ivory handle (which is the reason i bid for). I did not worry about this because ihave received quite a few keris from UK with ivory grip previously. but this time, the auction house declined to post to me. I then requested mailbox etc (which only a few months before sent a keris with ivory handle to me without any problem) but this time they refused. I found another one that is willing to apply for CITES certificate for my item and their initial quote for post + cites certificate process is around 235 pounds. The process is till ongoing and not completed yet. My winning bid was only 60 pounds. In conclusion i am basically screwed.
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#53 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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Ouch! Just curious, did the shipping firm itemize their price quote - CITES certificate fee, packing, shipping, insurance, their markup, etc? Once the paperwork is completed, what carrier will do the transport? ParcelForce, ccommercial courier, etc? I hope that with the certificate it can be delivered to you directly and not involve the services of a customs broker on your end to clear the importation which would result in additional fees.
I’ve had that experience when I bought an antique pistol from a London saleroom last year. Auction houses operate in a legal fishbowl and need to cross all their T’s and play by the rules all the way. My purchase had to go through a licensed freight forwarder ( and yes they had to show diligence re CITES to rule out ivory inlays) and because of the valuation on the invoice I needed a customs broker that cost me another $350 on my end plus the 400 quid that the UK shipper charged. Ridiculous, I thought, because all antiques enter the US duty free and there are no restrictions on flintlocks. But there was no way around this racket so just had to pay up and shuddup. Every country has different rules and though you said the value of your purchase was not that expensive, be sure that you check with your country’s customs office to verify what the formalities are for CITES affected material. The only point I’m trying to make to all is that in this day and age of myriad rules governing arms and animal species, it helps to be fully cognizant if all the issues and costs connected with getting something from A to B before you bid in an overseas auction. Last edited by Philip; 13th October 2019 at 02:41 AM. Reason: spelling |
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#54 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 36
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As a note for members, if anyone wins anything at auction near me (Wokingham, Berkshire, UK) I'd be happy to send it overseas to you. It's a long shot but thought I'd offer!
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#55 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Malaysia
Posts: 311
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Phillip;
The quotation given was an estimate by them and not itemized. But they did inform that for getting the CITES certificate alone, the cost is 90 pounds. I am waiting for the CITES process to be completed and wait for the actual invoice from them. To be fair, the auction house did offer to resell my won item in their future auction but I decided to apply for CITES certificate and keep my won item. I am not exactly sure what the custom officers at my end will do, as I no experience receiving shipment with CITES certificate before although I have received numerous ivory hilted items in the past several years without any problem from them. MForde: Thank you very much, that is very kind of you to help us with shipment. I'll keep this in mind if I have problems . For sure we'll not request you to ship ivory materials unless we have proper documentation. |
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#56 |
Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Paris (France)
Posts: 408
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Are there paints easily reversible?
To paint flintlock rifles with ivory inlay decoration or sheaths with some small, ivory-decorated parts? For handles ivory in revenche I do not see how to hide them discreetly. ![]() |
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#57 |
Member
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 57
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Hey guys, Not to gloat (too much), but I just had a box of swords arrive in California from Italy. It shipped FedEx International Economy on Wednesday, 10/9, and was delivered in California on Friday, 10/11, before 10 am.
However, a shipment earlier in the year from the same place with UPS had a 30 day FDA and Fish & Wildlife hold, and nothing biological inside. So I think luck is a factor. Also, please don't circumvent CITES. It invalidates provenance and encourages fakes. |
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#58 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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Getting caught trying to circumvent CITES, either on purpose or inadvertently, can have consequences beyond invalidation of provenance. Like confiscation and destruction. In the recent past, the Richard Wagner Jr collection in the US was liquidated, and a noted UK-based auctioneer was selected to handle disposal of this estate. The CITES-affected pieces were to be sold out of their San Francisco saleroom, the rest sent to London. About a dozen ivory hilted daggers were mistakenly shipped in the group destined for the UK. These were seized, the handles removed and destroyed, and the blades returned to the auctioneers for sale. Last edited by Philip; 13th October 2019 at 02:40 AM. |
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#59 | |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: California
Posts: 1,036
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I wouldn't have tried it on any surface that included wood, however. And now I wouldn't do it at all, because enforcement is tighter and the penalty, besides a fine, includes confiscation and destruction of the item (see the post I wrote above for a nasty example). The last time I did this was for an English gent who bought a nice ivory horse head shamshir at auction in the US and the seller refused to ship overseas. The blade was a piece of crap so my customer just said to yank and toss it, the hilt was what he was after. I stress the word LAST, I no longer accept any items for restoration that contain any CITES-affected material, not just ivory. It's just not worth it. Please, fellas -- don't cheat. And keep up on the CITES regs, as re the scope of species involved. It isn't about just ivory, tortoise, rhino and beagle feathers anymore. A friend just reported that a shipment of Oriental weapons sent to him from overseas had one item yanked -- a sword with ray skin covered handle. The inspector demanded that he prove that the species of ray fish that the hilt was covered with was not one of the endangered ones! And keeping in mind that most Japanese swords have ray skin of one species or another under the silk wrapping, you can see where this could possibly lead. And it wasn't too long ago that the Gibson guitar factory was shut down for awhile until the feds verified the source of one lot of African ebony that luthiers use for fingerboards on the necks of instruments. |
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#60 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Lancashire, England
Posts: 34
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